NWA/DAL Information Exchange...
#71
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,223
Short call lasts for 12 hours. This is because of the Whitlow rule. Your rest time clock starts anytime you are required to answer the phone under Whitlow. You must always be able to look back and see 8 hours rest in the previous 24. This means that keeping you on short call beyond 12 hours serves no purpose for the company since you don't have time to actually do any flying. Whitlow does not apply to international flying which is why short call is 24 hours long there.
If you are speaking of response time it is not defined as a hard number. If you are on short call you are expected to be promptly available. This is loosely defined as being able to report within 2 hours under normal conditions. If you are 2 hours driving time away and a traffic jam causes you to take 3 hours then that is fine.
Long call is 12 hours from the company initial attempt to contact you. You do not actually have to respond to that contact attempt for up to 9 hours. If you wait for 9 hours however you now have 3 hours left to get to work.
If you live in a co domicle base such as LAX or NYC the response time is a bit different on short call. You are only required to be within 2 hours of one of the airports served. This means that if you are LA based you can live in SD if your aircraft serves Orange County Airport as long as you can get there in 2 hours. You are allowed longer if they call you for a LAX trip. The same thing applies in NYC. If you live in PA and can make EWR in 2 hours you can sit short call at home. If they call you for a JFK trip you get there when you can.
Just don't do like one pilot. He was called for a short notice EWR trip. He told the scheduler that he could get to JFK in 2 hours but not EWR because of where he lived. Scheduler passed him up and used someone else. The next week same scheduler calls him again for a JFK short notice trip. He says sorry, I can get to EWR in 2 hours but can't make JFK because of where I live. That will get you the infamous CPR on your schedule. (Chief Pilot Review)
If you are speaking of response time it is not defined as a hard number. If you are on short call you are expected to be promptly available. This is loosely defined as being able to report within 2 hours under normal conditions. If you are 2 hours driving time away and a traffic jam causes you to take 3 hours then that is fine.
Long call is 12 hours from the company initial attempt to contact you. You do not actually have to respond to that contact attempt for up to 9 hours. If you wait for 9 hours however you now have 3 hours left to get to work.
If you live in a co domicle base such as LAX or NYC the response time is a bit different on short call. You are only required to be within 2 hours of one of the airports served. This means that if you are LA based you can live in SD if your aircraft serves Orange County Airport as long as you can get there in 2 hours. You are allowed longer if they call you for a LAX trip. The same thing applies in NYC. If you live in PA and can make EWR in 2 hours you can sit short call at home. If they call you for a JFK trip you get there when you can.
Just don't do like one pilot. He was called for a short notice EWR trip. He told the scheduler that he could get to JFK in 2 hours but not EWR because of where he lived. Scheduler passed him up and used someone else. The next week same scheduler calls him again for a JFK short notice trip. He says sorry, I can get to EWR in 2 hours but can't make JFK because of where I live. That will get you the infamous CPR on your schedule. (Chief Pilot Review)
#72
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,989
Ferd,
I haven't seen the JCBA on this but our last contract says you have to move to within 125 miles of base and establish your permanant residence. If your current residence is already within that distance, no go. Your new residence also has to be 50 statute miles closer to base than your former residence. If you move under these terms (and a couple of others, these are the major ones) you are committed to staying there (at the base) for at least 24 months or you have to reimbuse moving expenses. The move is good for 24 months from date of conversion to new category.
Denny
I haven't seen the JCBA on this but our last contract says you have to move to within 125 miles of base and establish your permanant residence. If your current residence is already within that distance, no go. Your new residence also has to be 50 statute miles closer to base than your former residence. If you move under these terms (and a couple of others, these are the major ones) you are committed to staying there (at the base) for at least 24 months or you have to reimbuse moving expenses. The move is good for 24 months from date of conversion to new category.
Denny
Counselor,
Does parking this in the crew lot qualify? Any NWA'ers know if they have clean showers in the crew lounge? Commuting to a DC9 FO gig means I need to cut expenses. When the lease is up, I'm thinking a van in the Detroit Airport parking lot might just be the thing. The other alternative for cheap home away from home living on reserve is shacking up with an chubby Flight Attendant. Either way, those ALPA sun shades will come in handy.
Sincerely,
Matt Foley, ATL 767 FO
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 12-13-2008 at 05:33 AM.
#73
Buck,
Not sure if that qualifies or not! I did hear that, years ago at LAX, there was a guy that was living in his RV in the airport parking lot. (Probably got kicked out by his now ex-wife!!) But he got busted and told to move.
Denny
Not sure if that qualifies or not! I did hear that, years ago at LAX, there was a guy that was living in his RV in the airport parking lot. (Probably got kicked out by his now ex-wife!!) But he got busted and told to move.
Denny
#74
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 581
For the (former) NWA guys, you should be aware that DAL scrutinizes moving expense claims pretty closely.
A couple of years ago I heard (from a very reliable source) that a few DAL pilots were terminated for moving expense fraud.
When I was a new hire I was told something like "All you have to do is show up for work on time and try." Similarly, I was told "Delta has zero tolerance for fraud or lying".
A couple of years ago I heard (from a very reliable source) that a few DAL pilots were terminated for moving expense fraud.
When I was a new hire I was told something like "All you have to do is show up for work on time and try." Similarly, I was told "Delta has zero tolerance for fraud or lying".
#75
For the (former) NWA guys, you should be aware that DAL scrutinizes moving expense claims pretty closely.
A couple of years ago I heard (from a very reliable source) that a few DAL pilots were terminated for moving expense fraud.
When I was a new hire I was told something like "All you have to do is show up for work on time and try." Similarly, I was told "Delta has zero tolerance for fraud or lying".
A couple of years ago I heard (from a very reliable source) that a few DAL pilots were terminated for moving expense fraud.
When I was a new hire I was told something like "All you have to do is show up for work on time and try." Similarly, I was told "Delta has zero tolerance for fraud or lying".
Quite true. This is not a system I would try to beat.
#77
No chance of DC-9 FO for you if they keep the 767's in ATL, right? Because, I'd hate to see that thing in DTW.
New K Now
#78
Thanks for clarifying that. I guess it is pretty much like ours, it's just nice to have the "AE" every month. I've never asked any DAL buddies about it specifically, but I haven't really heard any complaints about it either, so it muct work OK.
#79
Counselor,
Does parking this in the crew lot qualify? Any NWA'ers know if they have clean showers in the crew lounge? Commuting to a DC9 FO gig means I need to cut expenses. When the lease is up, I'm thinking a van in the Detroit Airport parking lot might just be the thing. The other alternative for cheap home away from home living on reserve is shacking up with an chubby Flight Attendant. Either way, those ALPA sun shades will come in handy.
Sincerely,
Matt Foley, ATL 767 FO
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