BS! Everything cost money, a mere $20k or even $80k pales in comparison to the financial benefits you’ll receive in return with a successful mil and airline career. In a perfect world, ya you wouldn’t want to spend anymore than you’d have to, however Dingdong or every inspiring pilot here has no idea if they’ll survive the gauntlet of becoming a rated pilot.
200+ hours will maximize that portion of your PCSM score. With zero hours, the highest total score you will be able to obtain is 70. These numbers were developed from studies conducted by the AF regarding the relationship between civ time and UPT success rates.
You may not pass your Flying Class I medical.
I gaurentee lots of civ time will give you an advantage in UPT during Phase I and II. By Phase III everyone is pretty much up to speed and it’s a more level
playing field.
Currently they are allowing students with high time to skip T-6’s entirely. I feel you’re missing some of the best few months of your life if you do but that’s how the AF feels about civ time.
It’s RIDICULOUS to suggest that too much civ time will make UPT more difficult and you’ll just have to unlearn things. That’s like saying going the military route to airlines will just make things more difficult because when you get to 121 you’ll have to unlearn things. Everyone knows about negative transfer but more perspective is always better.
Can you operate a Mac and a PC?

I find it most odd how the OP has been in for 6 years but doesn't know the difference between a TDY and PCS

Hi, most applications are getting picked up at the UPT boards right now due to the high demand. Most of our applicants have a PPL and scores in 80s and 90s for pilot and PCSM.

I highly recommend getting the PPL and making your intentions known. Also, don't limit yourself to only your base. You can seek sponsorship from any unit at any base. Reach out to your local officer recruiter, we all have a POC list with all of the contacts for all of squadrons.

Best of luck!

MSgt Poltor

Thank you everyone for your responses.

I can see where it may appear as though I don't know the difference between TDY and PCS but I mostly asked just to be affirm what I thought would happen. My IADT had me gone for 16 months including a PCS (but were still considered students) for the second phase of my training since it was about 9 months. The last time I left my reserve unit was when I was on IADT. In addition, being in my career field and in the reserves, we're never given any opportunities to go anywhere for AT because our field is too technical/specialized and both my troop and I are mostly qualified as phlebotomists, though I work as a civilian lab tech. If I were a something else that was much more broad/versatile, I would be a bit more up to date on all of the different acronyms besides lab related stuff.

I do apologize if it appears as though I'm trolling or anything. The 6 years that I've been in the military have been stuck in a corner working in a lab that I had to lead after only being there for 10 months. We have multiple individuals over us that isn't even in our career field and finally realize there's a lot we have to do for only being a reserve lab. Due to the delays and lack of budget and supervision in our field, neither my troop and I have finished our CDCs or completed ALS. It took a number of years for members in my unit to understand that we're not just bsing that were are busy the entire weekend. There's only 2 of us to collect, process, order, and ship 200+ specimens a month, in addition to all the other mandatory things we have to do during a UTA. As an example, for this upcoming UTA my troop as to shoot at the range all day and I have a PT test, which means no experience lab tech will be present for about half the day to do all of the above. I hope I'm not coming off whiny or anything but just trying to explain why it may appear as though I'm unfamiliar w/certain areas in the Air Force.

This has been a quick summary of my 6 years enlistment. It has led me to vent to you all (thank you for reading to the end) and is one of the reasons why I want out of said career (military + civilian) and became interested in aviation. I came to the realization that there's a lot more I'm missing out on due to this career.

Thank you everyone. :o

In a flying squadron, it’ll be different, not always better or worse, but different.

GF

I think you'll find not many here share your opinion.
Just to be clear, I never said "zero hours". I said if a PPL makes him more competitive, that's the most he should do. He is a candidate for an internal hire at his own reserve unit, so if they want him to go, he'll go.

There's not a Guard or Reserve unit out there that's going to require anyone to complete a 141 training program to be considered for a pilot slot. PPL? Sure, why not. It's probably a good way for him to put his toe in the water and decide if he really has any aptitude for it.

If he doesn't pass his medical or doesn't get the pilot slot, then he can spend all his GI bill money and go into big debt if he wants to keep pursuing an aviation career on the civilian side (assuming he can get a class-1 from the FAA). If he doesn't make it through UPT, he can decide if spending all that dough is his next step or take a different path altogether.

No. You really can't guarantee that. If it helped you... great.

But, everyone is different. A large percentage of pilots I flew the F-15 with were zero or low hour students when they went to UPT. They excelled, were distinguished grads and went on to be great Eagle drivers. Others had lots of hours and did just as well. But the first guy to wash out of my UPT class was a CFII with a ton of civilian time. Another guy was a 3000 hour commercial pilot, ended up at the bottom of the barrel and he was lucky to graduate with a set of wings. So, in my opinion, it's much more dependent on the person and their aptitude, work ethic, etc. than getting lots of non-mil flying time before UPT.

No. It's really not like saying that at all.
One is a pilot with 10 years or more of aviation experience making a transition to employment in another aviation field. The other is a student pilot attempting to build basic foundational skills in a unique military training environment. Mil to civilian is not the same thing as civilian to mil.
Again - it depends on the individual. Don't discount the power of habits and training "muscle memory". Some pilots have a great deal of trouble relearning skills in a new way.

I think the bottom line here is - if someone needs to spend 5-figures and get a bunch of ratings to make it through UPT, they probably need to find another line of work than being a mil pilot. It's not a kinder, gentler civilian training program where if you have enough time and money, you can get enough "do-overs" until you make it through. Although, who knows? - if the USAF is hurting enough for pilots maybe it'll turn into that. Let's hope not.

100% agree

As a 10 year T-6 instructor I’ve seen thousands come through and I’ve learned that prior flying experience only helps you in the very beginning. Sure, there are outliers, but for as many prior experience guys who killed it, there are just as many IFT-only, 12-hour total time guys doing the same. The secret to doing well in UPT is a strong desire to succeed, a good attitude, and work ethic.

As to the original poster, get what flying ratings you need to be competitive for the job you want. Then, take that extra $$$ you woulda spent and either pay off your debt or invest it in your future.

AFTrainerGuy -

Is it true what the other poster said about people with prior civilian time being allowed to skip T-6s entirely?

I thought I had heard of accelerated programs before, but I have a hard time believing that the entire program of instruction could be skipped.

I know that AF and Naval aviation training differs in some respects, but there is stuff in Primary for the naval services that many with civilian time would not have been necessarily exposed too - and with respect to competing then for follow-on community assignments - it seems that would be impossible.

AFTrainerGuy,

Can an experienced civilian pilot skip T-6? I can’t believe it, frankly. Surely, they’re not starting in 38s, so maybe T-1s

GF

There was supposed to be a trial class of 141 college grads with a decent amount of time going straight to the T1 as an experiment. Haven’t heard anything about it in a while. I hear more about Pilot Training Next, where they skip T1/T38s and go straight to the FTU after 6 months of T6s and a bunch of VR training.

Yes... but it’s not a lot of them and not sure if it’s just a trial or what. It’s for Guard/Reserve guys going to Heavy Squadron with lots of prior experience (I think ATP?) and they just go to T-1’s.

I’m a T-6 guy so really haven’t paid attention but I personally know of 1 who did it (even though personally he wanted to go to T-6’s first but had no choice)