Difference is your "flight instructor" wasn't fighting to protect you and your country....I assume since you didn't call him an IP..Have a little respect for Sonny..end the conversation now.

You have touched the tar-baby

So a death of a person is diminished by the fact that he didn't serve our country? His life was less important or meaningless because he didn't serve our country. There is no "difference" in human life. All human lives are equal of importance. Show some respect for human beings, not just those who serve!!!!

Dude, your rants are wrong. This forum section is to talk about military issues and this thread is about a buddy of ours who died while doing his best to keep the folks on the ground a little safer. Sonny lost his life doing just that, he was at the tip of the sword of our nation’s defense. I’m sorry you lost your first flight instructor, but we are talking about the men and women (USAF, Navy Mariners and Army) who each day go across the fence, some of them don’t make it back. I bet your instructor wasn’t in the same situation. You sir need to show a little respect to the people in this forum and the rest of us in the uniform. You're are obviously not military, so for the good of everyone can you just leave.

Respect is something you earn, not demand. I fully support and respect the men and women who serve our country altogether, not just those who go to war and never come back. I support our entire armed forces. I also support the families of those who serve because they also make sacrifices while their loved ones are serving both home and abroad. I know this because I am a son, and brother of those who have served, my father in Korea, my brother in Iraq. My brother still serves our country today and helps protect our city as a police officer.

My rants are projected towards slice, and those who support his hypocracy. I will not sit idle while insults are hurled at me while they hide behind a supposed curtain of service. I never once said anything to diminish the service or sacrafice of those who have died while protecting our country. I have said that all human life is equal regardless if you serve or not.

Dude,

then PM Slice directly, stop using this forum for that purpose, it's old.

That's the second time you have addressed me as dude. Are you a surfer *** or what DUDE?

How come nobody here has the guts to side with bobloblaw and his obviously superior argument, both factually and morally?

I agree with bobloblaw. Military service or not, I believe in the inherent worth and dignity in every human being. I think it's funny how, just because Slice disengaged from the debate, everybody feels obligated to fight bobloblaw.

reCALcitrant, it is inhumane to say that the loss of a flight instructor doesn't match that of a military man/woman. In fact, it's pathetic for you to even think of such a thing. I'm sure that the fighter pilot who crashed would be appalled by your reasoning, for it would be much harder for him to execute his job of putting his life on the line for America if he didn't believe in the dignity of every American citizen, now wouldn't it?

And, GBU-24, you should also stop inferring that bobloblaw's flight instructor was on a lower tier than the fighter pilot who died in Iraq. Have you died yet? Huh? Do you want to be remembered less than a serviceman or woman? GBU, it's no crime to want recognition or respect, but you HAVE TO EARN IT. Stop assuming that all servicemen and women automatically deserve that respect (e.g., look at the soldiers who abused the prisoners several years ago in Abu Gharib [excuse my spelling].)

Bobloblaw, your argument is perfectly logical and not hypocritical in the least. Just thought I'd reassure you that there are still some sensible people out there other than yourself ;)

I appreciate it!

Quoting planecrazyjenn here,

"Show some respect for someone who died doing what they love."

. . . maybe like bobloblaw's flight instructor?

NO, he wasn't serving his country. Hmmmph, so that won't work out . . . :P jk

You get it! And I appreciate it very much.

LOL, if you said that to Slice about his friend, he would go apesh** on your @$$. You're lucky boblowblaw can show some self-restraint :eek:

Hey spotta, quit spotting. Don't you have summer school or something to go to? It's not your place to tell any of these guys (Slice/GBU/Cal) the time of day, even in the anonymity of the internet.

When you've been shot at and not crapped your pants call me back. And no, Xbox doesn't count.

Your good buddy blow hasn't shown the ability to have any self restraint about anything. Do a search of all his previous posts all over this board and you'll notice that he's always playing "thread-policeman" because of his hair-trigger sensitivities. In all his posts you're the FIRST person I've ever seen defend him. Nice company eh?

Not to mention the fact that he's 37 years old, stuck in the right seat at Eagle probably forever, and has homosexual fantasies involving MR T and the WWF (you'll find all that in Hangar talk).

And he still hasn't figured out that computers will spell check for you.

Uh, maybe it has something to do with the fact that bob started the whole damn thing. Slice made a comment that it couldn't have been a D model since the crash was in Iraq, and bob somehow decided this meant that Slice didn't respect soldiers in Iraq.

Actually, I don't feel you have the right to speak to me that way, regardless of my age. I'm not as immature as many people my age. I'm not an Xbox fan. Frankly, I don't see how being shot at and getting back alive has anything to do with the price of tea in China.

I make the high honor roll at school, so don't give me this sh** about summer school.

And, finally, what do you mean it's not my place to wake these people up? I'm just saying that I believe in the dignity of every human being, and if they don't think the same thing, then I don't know how they could stand serving their nation if they didn't feel who they were fighting for at home was worth defending.

Maybe they joined so that they could get into the airlines in the aftermath. Maybe not. The point is, stop acting like I should let ignorance go unnoticed just because I'm 17 years old. I have much more experience in life than many other people my age, and I frankly don't care if you think my opinion doesn't count. After all, an opinion is an opinion is an opinion. Nothing makes one's opinion count more than another's.

Yeah, now I do see that bobloblaw did sort of blow Slice's words out of context (i.e., Slice didn't mean to say that his death meant more because it transpired in Iraq.)

Still, that doesn't mean I don't support the fact that there is inherent worth and dignity in every human being.

No there isn't.

Example please?

I don't think any 17 year old should speak to an adult like you are now. If you were here in person, I'd have my kids tell you to shut up, since they're all older than you, and I'm pretty sure that even my daughter could make you squirt tears.

Try talking to your parents like that jr. I'd keep the padded underpants on because, if you still got a daddy at home, his foot is going to be headed for your a$$.

If you were standing in a room with the guys you're trying to "wake up", you'd be begging them to tell you about their flying experiences and how you might someday end up like them. They certainly wouldn't be looking to you for help with their algebra homework, or give a crap about your wake-up call.

You wanna talk flying, I'm game. You want to continue this rant, you can join BLOW in invisible land.

John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy...do I need to keep going?

You forgot bobloblaw.

I've shown much more restraint than bloblow. He made a lame joke about Ash's wife and couldn't take a simple reply. He then turned this thread into something useless by rants that make no sense and continued to do so despite the request to stop by friends of the deceased. That's called lack of respect and immaturity. Do you want to be known as 'Baghdad Bob' around these parts? You're choosing to be a spokesman for a moron.

PS- on your other post...dude, you're 17, you don't know as much as you think you do. No different than anyone else here when they were your age. Gonna be a pretty hard sell.

I'd like to see him thrown off this place before it turns into that other forum (F.I.). --not you spotter.

Would you rather I not carry on a civilized debate?

How old is your daughter? I wrestle and fence, and doubt she could make me cry.

I don't talk to my parents this way (because we love each other and respect our differences), and frankly, I don't think my age should play any role in this debate (which I don't want to continue -- see my final paragraph.) If my age is your main point, then you have a failing argument. Do I have to be an adult to post here? Do I have to be an adult to respond to the opinions of an adult? Or, should I just be reduced to an obsequious level because of my age?

Now, let's talk flying :) I'm not a big fan of internet fights.

Yeah, yeah, I know. I just realized that bobloblaw's original impetus for the argument was flawed (he misinterpreted your assertion that Ds aren't in Iraq as an attack on the individuals who didn't die in Iraq.)

I am not bob's spokesperson. I fell victim to his misinterpretation of your statement about the Ds. If you agree with me that it wouldn't make any difference if he died in Iraq/Afghanistan/USA, then I will stop arguing. The aforementioned point is all that I'm fighting for.

Also, I really only joined these forums to talk planes, guys :o:), not to get into ethical debates. So, please don't add me to "the invisible" world, as I would like to hear your opinions as I move closer to my dream career.

Slice, I did make a comment about Arthur Ash's wife. I said she was nice up until she died of AIDS. Your reply was " would cancer have been better." I waited for an opportunity to do the same to you and it didn't take long. You had said the F16 pilot died in Iraq. I asked if it would be better if he died in Afganhastan. I did not misinterpret your remarks about the D-model. Others here do not understand my beef with you, but chose to defend you. It didn't take long for your idiotic supporters to show their true colors and lack of respect for human life when I said my flight instructor was killed.

You supporters had said that his death was different because he didn't die for his country or serve. Even though the circumstances of death are different the result is the same. Human beings lost their lives and are no longer with us.

Slice, I know you may not see this because you chose to put me on an ignore list, HAHAHAH! Just shows you can't stand the heat coming back at you.

Include me with rapist and mass murderers. And you hold yourself on a high horse. With comments like yours there is no way you are an officer.

She's 21, played hockey on her high school team (like wrestling and fencing on ice with knives attached to your feet) and is in the Army. She scares ME.

You don't have to be an adult to post here, but know your audience. Realize that there's a big difference between 17 and 34, and most of the dudes you're talking to are older than 34 and have been flying for a LONG TIME.

Would you take advice or heed the wake up call of most new HS freshman? Heck, no! You're a senior! Think about it in that context and you might realize why a battle seasoned fighter pilot might dis-regard you out of hand.

Like a wise Major told me when I was a big-mouthed Lt, "Never pass up an opportunity to keep your mouth shut." Some of the best advice I ever actually listened to.

You didn't listen! I do admit though it is harder to understand you singleengine with your foot in your mouth.

italics: Nice point. You've bested me :o

underlined: I do have a problem with not keeping my mouth shut :o

I just realized that you have me on your ignore list. You still post and reference me in your posts, but chose to not be able to see any of my retorts. And I am the child!!!

Still, I won't give up on the point that bobloblaw's flight instructor's death is of no lower status than that of the F-16 pilot. They both died doing what they loved, and that is very honorable.

She single? ;)

You're not datin' my daughter until you change your avatar!

but seriously, she's married, and you'd currently have to go to Iraq to meet her.

No, boyee! :)

No one should be saying that the CFI's death is any less important...but to compare a civilian who died in a peacetime situation to someone who died in a hostile situation are two different things (however no less important). While I do believe that some people are just oxygen thieves, that doesn't make them any less important in the grand scheme of things.

Where the problem comes in at is that bob came into a thread with a patriotic poster group and made a coment that was directly offensive to many people. Plane you are 17, you are not in the military and have never been to war. That doesn't make your opinion important, but it doesn't mean much to a bunch of people who have been in a combat zone and have lost friends in war. Bob should have taken his comments off the board. I saw the comments refering to the aids/cancer deal. Whether or not that was appropriate, he still shouldn't have came here and made a comment that would offend many. He's a grown made and knew that.

Sorry, I'm just a little confused. What are you trying to say here :confused:

What is a grown made?

blah blah damn fingers

'Man' my apologies. I am limited to one handed typing for a while and it sucks.

Plane that should read that it doesn't make it any less important...

If you don't mind my asking, did that dolphin in your avatar happen to do something naughty to your hand? :eek: ;)

No I was rushed into the hospital last week for massive internal bleeding due to other medical problems and developed a complication that so far is keeping me from using my right hand. I have a follow up monday and a referrel to a neurologist. The dolphin in my avatar has nothing to do with this but they are fun to work with.