Can the 0.3 Sortie Conversion apply to ATP?
 

All,

I am a Line Pilot/Recruiter wondering if the 0.3 Sortie Conversion factor can be used towards the 1500 total time required by for the ATP. A large portion of our pilots are veteran Military Aviators that we were able to help by allowing the use of the 0.3 Conversion Factor. Our requirement has been raised from the ATP-CTP or Restricted ATP to the actual ATP. This Candidate is at just over 1400 total time, but his Sortie conversion would bring them up to over 1700 TT.

Any help or guidance to help a fellow aviator would be appreciated.

Thanks.

IIRC all military UPT graduates are RATP eligible at 750TT mil hours (minus NOAA), the sortie conversion factor is not regulatory but a concession for candidates who have other desirable qualities (tactical/fast jet experience, leadership) that they would not meet otherwise.

Is the 1400 mil hours or a mix of both?

To use different words to say what onepoint said, there is no such thing as a sortie conversion factor as far as the FAA is concerned. Some airlines choose to allow applicants to highlight certain types of flying that they believe is of value by applying a conversion factor. But that is for hiring at that particular airline. Once hired, it no longer becomes a "thing" and is not used for upgrades or anything else that has logged hour requirements by the FAA.

His time is mixed Mil and Civ..
 

Thanks for the response.. The Candidate has 1400 TT mixed between Military and Civilian time UNCONVERTED. With the Conversion Factor, the time comes up to around 1700 hours. We can’t hire them until they actually get the ATP Unrestricted, so I was wondering if the FAA will accept that Conversion Factor to get the candidate up over the 1500 hour requirement needed for the Unrestricted ATP.

His time is mixed Mil and Civ..
 

Thanks for the response.. The Candidate has 1400 TT mixed between Military and Civilian time UNCONVERTED. With the Conversion Factor, the time comes up to around 1700 hours. We can’t hire them until they actually get the ATP Unrestricted, so I was wondering if the FAA will accept that Conversion Factor to get the candidate up over the 1500 hour requirement needed for the Unrestricted ATP.

This issue comes up occasionally.

The only rational answer I've ever been able to see is NO.

Employers do that for obvious reasons.

But there is no language in the FAR's that even hints that you can do that, it's black and white and falls back on FAR definitions of flight time.

Now if the military logs time in a manner that excludes what would otherwise be legal FAR time (ex taxi for purpose of flight) then you would be well within your rights to log that in a civilian logbook as you go and I would probably recommend that (it's just not on the radar for mil folks who have no civilian experience).

But coming back after the fact and trying to apply a blanket conversion to all your time would be very thin ice for FAA purposes IMO. That would be like a CFI not logging any time and after two years of teaching going back and estimating ten flights a week to get to 1500 hours.

Like anything in this biz it depends on who at the FAA you ask… the military flight time calculations do not count taxi to takeoff like a GA or civilian sortie… so id recommend that a military pilot could use the taxi time from engine start to takeoff in their private log books and couple that with their mil flight records… just need to explain if ever questioned.

Get the answer from the FSDO. With that said, one possible path forward may be:

You are pursuing an FAA issued certificate/rating/license. FAA flight time requirements (and definitions must be met).

RE:

https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-1...-1/section-1.1

I would stop the use of the term "sortie conversion" etc stuff as it raises alarm bells with some folks.

Instead carefully audit military flight time records and documents and transfer the accurate FAA-definition flight times into an civilian logbook. Make sure that logbook is 100 bona-find truthful and accurate, and could pass a forensic exam, and you would have zero sleep loss if the FAA themselves, the JAG office, the FBI, and Congress borrowed the logbook for 2 weeks to check the numbers.

"Did you use a sortie conversion factor to come up with these times?"

No (true statement)- these times are an accurate representation of FAA flight time definitions.

That's a good way of looking at it. You can log your own time, ideally do it as you go and best not to even mention conversion factors or reconstruction after the fact.

Also in the event that someone were to compare your civilian and military records, it might appear suss if every single sortie had exactly 0.3 more logged in the civilian book.

The FARs define flight time different than the military. The military does not count taxi time. Therefore it is an accepted practice for military applicants to add .3 to each sortie to account for this discrepancy.
Each pilot is in charge of their own logs. If one wants to audit their military flight records and add .3 to each sortie, I think that is a completely reasonable practice and would be very conservative.