Russian Stealth Fighter
 

There is no certainty the Russia will even be willing to spend the money to acquire the PAK FA. It could very expensive but still not meet true fifth-generation fighter metrics. They might well end up going with 4.5 generation aircraft...probably souped up flankers.

I have heard about this before, but I was secretly hoping that the plane appeared better than it truly was. Now I am second guessing that. The 400 meter takeoff roll is very impressive as are the claims that it is more economical than the F-22. This would not surprise me because the US’s greatest strength, and weakness, is its ability and desire to build things without compromise. The Russians always seemed willing to make sacrifices on capability to cut costs and out produce us. They fact that they are planning to export this is also alarming. We can’t afford to participate in this technology race right now, but depending on what countries get this plane, we might have to. It could be like the 1980s except now Russia might lead in the military spending and drive our economy to the brink (even more than it is now).

On a more positive note, it could be like most new Russian fighters where its bark is worse than its bite. Also, if both countries can play nice, it would be the greatest showdown ever to see how the F-22 and the T-50 do in some friendly mock dogfights. And, depending on how economical the T-50 is, maybe we could get some to supplement the F-22 fleet :rolleyes:.

We don't have to compete in a technology race...we are already solidly in the 5th generation world. The russians and everyone else are trying to match our level, which is a very difficult proposition without many tens of billions (with a B) of dollars to blow on R&D.

Do we have enough F-22's? Debatable, but if we need to counter a 4.5, or 4.8 generation foriegn fighter we can always buy more F-35's...that production line is going to be open for a very long time.

I find it almost implausible that anyone could get ahead of this in this arena any time in the next several decades. Motivation, innovation, dedication, and hordes of bright third-world engineers (trained in the US) will not be enough...it also requires a ludicrous amount of $$$. We probably spent more developing the F-22 than any other nation's entire annual defense budget...several times over.

The Russians have had a hard time 1) buying new equipment and 2) bringing new hardware from testing to operational use. Unless Putin has found new sources of money (and maybe he is counting on the gas/oil reserves), it is unlikely the new Sukhoi will be on the front line anytime soon.

As for the F-22.. it is an orphan. As for the F-35... hmmm.. slow, short range, not very nimble, not stealthy. Good reason to remember the old axioms, "Never fly the A model of anything" and "The C model eventually demonstrates the abilities that the A was supposed to have." :D

I am sure that the F-22 is superior when compared to the T-50, but as Russians have proved before, they simply make up for what they lack in capability with numbers. Just because we outspend every other country when it comes to our military doesn’t mean some resourceful Russian can’t make a plane that is 90% as capable but 30% cheaper than the F-22.

I think that we have plenty of F-22s for any realistic situation, but if Russia is able to produce and sell this aircraft in numbers approaching 1000, our technological perch won’t seem so high. It would be an interesting dynamic if countries we are technically allies with, like Russia and India, gain stealth technology.

I was never too excited about the F-35. For me, it would make more sense to have a few top of the line highly advanced fighters (F-22) to use in those rare occasions where we would have to fight for air supremacy in an area with heavy radar. Then once we eliminate their air force and take out antiaircraft sites, we could use traditional fighters that would be cheaper to build and operate.

I don’t really see where the F-35 fits into the picture. It is designed to take over the role of the F-16, but I don’t get why they spent so much money making it stealthy. If we need a fighter to go into a radar environment, then send in an F-22. If we need a fighter to go to a place without radar, send in a brand new F-15 or F-16 model that we could have developed for the money we spent on the F-35. I can’t think of a battlefield situation that calls for moderate stealth capability.

Would anyone else support another attempt at the F-20? The nearly 30 year old design is still impressive today, so only imagine what it could look like now if we invested even only half the money the F-35 got.

I agree that the F-22 seems to be an orphan, but the F-35 , if it ever becomes to be (you can tell I have little faith in any present timelines) is already a leap in technology above the F-22 from the briefs that I saw. The potential of that aircraft, especially in the targeting systems and the amount of SA gathered and displayed, is far above anything flying right now. As for never flying the 'A' model of anything, i can partially agree except for later Lots of an 'A' model. I have quite a few hours in the 'A' model of Hornet and it was quite capable :D

The Russians have a history of being less impressed with fine details and being more interested in brute power, What hasn't been demonstrated is a trained crew -vs- trained crew to an equal degree. An example would be T-80 tanks in the hands of the Iraqis were no match whatsoever against western main battle tanks in Desert Storm. There is no deate that the T-80 isn't a good tank, but in the hands of children who don't know how to employ them to their advantage they were sitting ducks.

It will be interesting to watch if this airplane actually has an evolution in its' destiny. Sadly, I'll be watching this show from the sidelines :(

USMCFLYR

But wouldn’t it be possible to put those same avionics and targeting systems into a cheaper airframe? Or in the sense of standardization, why not design an avionics, weapons, and targeting package that are the same for all fighters. Of course there could be minor modifications of software and hardware for specific cases.

That is basically what the F-35 will be. It is replacing much more than just the F-16 that you mentioned earlier. As far as a cheaper airframe - you are already seeing that. Many of those sensors and avionics and targeting systems are going into a variety of UAVs. In other situations, if you want the capability that will be brought to the battlefield with these new system then no.....you can't get them necessarily on older, cheaper airframes. The US military likes the idea of smaller, sleeker, more capable forces. We rely on our technological superiority over the mass numbers of less capable aircraft. the question you pose about a fewer number of more expensive aircraft versus the large number of cheaper aircraft is as old as weapons themselves. Aren't you wanting to go ito the military soon? Maybe you will find yourself in the acquisition field. We could really use some good, smart people who actually know how to manage capability and money at the same time. IMO.

USMCFLYR