chrisreedrules

Same here... I've had Ernie for 4 check rides and I think he is awesome. A lot of people think he's really tough but if you know what he is looking for (as it goes with most DPEs) then you will do fine. He has always been extremely fair with me on my checkrides and he even requested to do a lot of the flying on my multi-commercial because he hadn't flown the Tecnam all that much. He did a couple touch-n-go's, and I think some steep turns and gave me the controls back and we went back to CRG for a full-stop. Every ride I've taken with him I also learn something useful/new... And I can appreciate that.

Ray Blaszak

That's because he is an instructor first DPE second. One thing I can't stand about ATP they only care about one thing; how much the DPE makes that week. There's a reason why they get so many check ride passes it isn't necessarily because people can fly. When your spoon fed several grand a week you'll pass the weak.

BDGERJMN

Ray, I'm curious what your background is that might draw you to the conclusion(from what I'm reading) that they are 'check ride' passes vs supposed failures?

As a military aviator, I think it's safe to say that an ATP checkride is just that, another checkride and those of us who have 10-20 yrs of flying experience in our respective platforms have flown our fair share of checkrides. To me, the ATP was just that a checkride and a check in the box, not to see if I knew the Seminole backwards and forwards but much bigger; can I handle complex emergencies, execute good headwork and sound judgement, while still allowing basic airmanship to happen. It's really that simple. If the ATP process was so messed up, then why isn't the FAA more stringent? Simple..the ATP process leverages existing exprience in making a determination about one's ability to do just what I said. Further, the FAA understands that individual airline training programs are in place to further that process in addition to providing oversight.

I do see some of what you're saying for someone with less experience in dynamic and stressed aviation environments, and I think that in those cases, the performance of the person applying for the ATP shines through. I have known military aviators to fail the ATP checkride for one reason or another...so it does happen.

Ray Blaszak

I'm referring to ATP flight school not the ATP check ride itself. Any one who has attended the school knows that's the reason they get business. I can't tell you how many times I over heard conversations about how the instructor needed to hurry up and get their student into a check ride just so the examiner could have at least 1 a day. Trust me their are multiple check ride failures as well but I flew with guys and seriously sat there the whole time wondering how the hell they ever passed a check ride they were that ate up. Maybe they were a shining star on check ride day, maybe the DPE felt sorry for them, I certainly am not god's gift to aviation. Trust me I walked away from multiple check rides thinking what the heck happened even though I did my best performance. Now to answer your original question after slight clarification as to talking about ATP flight school and not the ATP it self I graduated the program after electing to not do CFI school because I ended getting hired at a sky diving place. After shortly getting hired by them that gig fell through for various reasons and than I found out I can't obtain a 2nd or 1st class medical because of an eye sight problem. So as far as my and aviation goes it may never happen other than me wanting to own my own airplane one day. Times are tough when you need 500 hours + to land an "entry" level job.

Lefty37

I must say that I completely concur with the originator of this thread. I did the 2-day program and extended it to the 4-day program, and passed the checkride with ease (relatively). I had no previous experience in the Seminole and none in twin engine props. While the aircraft systems are simple, the relative aircraft speeds are slow, and you can do the checklists with flows then referencing the checklist ala UPT style. For pilots who have their most recent experience in crew aircraft it can be a steep learning curve relearning these habits in two flights . While I have no comment about Jacksonville, I would advise to do your ATP training/checkride at a location where there are suitable out bases to accomplish approaches, and you feel comfortable. While the ATP facility at Las Vegas is acceptable, the density of traffic, lack of suitable out-bases to accomplish approaches away from heavy ATC, and Chinook winds off of the mountains make this location far from ideal. While from my experience, the Chicago location though close to two Class B airports provides ample room, and great ATC controllers. Making my ATP training experience at ATP well worth the expense. While others experiences may wildly vary, this is my two cents of experience from getting my ATP at ATP.