TMC/Wheels UP
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Posts: 166
Why can't you answer questions posed out in the open? This and your previous posts request people message you. Why not post your information in the open so all can benefit, especially if it is so positive?
#13
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 162
After reaching out to an old colleague who I trust. Position and title will remain anonymous but is a TMC employee. The certificate it self is about to be WUP so that we already knew. Despite the horror stories I have heard on TMC. I don’t think TMC will have a lot if any thing to do with what’s about to happen. The question is who does WUP place as D.O. and CP. IF they keep the current TMC personal in place. It may not be a good thing for GAMA Pilots. ( His words not mine). IF the GAMA personnel are retained thing should be alright. How ever as far as compensation,Duty,Vacation,Scheduales that will fall directly as who WUP management ( Or who they place in charge) decision. I understand TMC current compensation package will not really have any bearing on wheelsup. I would guess this would be the first question imposed on WUP if they ever conduct a Q&A.
Last edited by LLWS09R; 06-08-2019 at 09:03 AM.
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2015
Position: Begging for a crew meal
Posts: 233
#15
Hello
Like others on here I work for GAMA. I usually read post and don’t get involved. However I guess I am now on a fact finding mission. I along with other pilot have no delusions WUP will ultimately move all airplanes over to TMC (soon to be WUP) certificate with in a year or two. I’m not on the band wagon that’s says that’s bad but I’m also skeptical.
My question come strictly from a apple to apples comparison.
Let me start by saying I recently reviewed the TMC threads. While I understand pilots hold grudges. TMC seems to have a lot of pilots with grudges from a small operation that is alarming to me. This is why I’m a first time caller long time listener. It would seem TMC may have made changes recently but I guess it’s in the eye of the beholder. 90% of the reason I came to GAMA was I found very few if any complaints with there way of doing things.
A. What is First Officer 1st year pay ( No bonus and no expected over time). Straight pay?
B. What is 1st year pilot vacation time?
C. What is TMC family insurance rate?
D. Is your 8/6 schedule mean that day 8 you go home day 8 ( assuming no break downs/ weather problems) or is it a we will try....?More or Less GAMA knows your what your go home days is and makes sure you get routed in away to allow a crew swap. Some of your former pilots have indicated it’s a guide line more than a guarantee?
E. Many former TMC pilots on this thread have clearly stated TMC is a “ Get the job done regardless of a pilots concerns” Now I will state the FAA leave a lot of room for interpretation and basic minimums. However anyone who’s flown any real time knows that you can’t really have a rule for every scenario. Allowing all 135 and 121 companies free reign to say those famous words “ Technically it’s legal”. But do your supervisors support pilot safety concerns? And if you say YES. Why have so many pilots current/former suggested other wise?
I will repeat myself this is in no way a bashing but, honest facts Finding questions. Like in an interview I know no ones perfect but if at one time you had a problem. I would like to know why it happen and what has been changed to fix it.
Like others on here I work for GAMA. I usually read post and don’t get involved. However I guess I am now on a fact finding mission. I along with other pilot have no delusions WUP will ultimately move all airplanes over to TMC (soon to be WUP) certificate with in a year or two. I’m not on the band wagon that’s says that’s bad but I’m also skeptical.
My question come strictly from a apple to apples comparison.
Let me start by saying I recently reviewed the TMC threads. While I understand pilots hold grudges. TMC seems to have a lot of pilots with grudges from a small operation that is alarming to me. This is why I’m a first time caller long time listener. It would seem TMC may have made changes recently but I guess it’s in the eye of the beholder. 90% of the reason I came to GAMA was I found very few if any complaints with there way of doing things.
A. What is First Officer 1st year pay ( No bonus and no expected over time). Straight pay?
B. What is 1st year pilot vacation time?
C. What is TMC family insurance rate?
D. Is your 8/6 schedule mean that day 8 you go home day 8 ( assuming no break downs/ weather problems) or is it a we will try....?More or Less GAMA knows your what your go home days is and makes sure you get routed in away to allow a crew swap. Some of your former pilots have indicated it’s a guide line more than a guarantee?
E. Many former TMC pilots on this thread have clearly stated TMC is a “ Get the job done regardless of a pilots concerns” Now I will state the FAA leave a lot of room for interpretation and basic minimums. However anyone who’s flown any real time knows that you can’t really have a rule for every scenario. Allowing all 135 and 121 companies free reign to say those famous words “ Technically it’s legal”. But do your supervisors support pilot safety concerns? And if you say YES. Why have so many pilots current/former suggested other wise?
I will repeat myself this is in no way a bashing but, honest facts Finding questions. Like in an interview I know no ones perfect but if at one time you had a problem. I would like to know why it happen and what has been changed to fix it.
Why would you think Wheels up will morph into TMC? WUP bought TMC so if anything I think TMC will morph into WUP and adopt their pay scales and work rules.
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Posts: 166
WUP does not employ pilots or have a certificate (that is until they bought TMC). WUP contracts out to Gama Aviation to manage the aircraft and provide crews. The concern is that WUP will migrate planes over to the TMC certificate to bring it "in house" and cut out the middle man that is Gama. Thus Gama would let all the crew go. The concern isn't that the crew wouldn't be able to get a job with TMC, WUP would still need crews after all. The concern is that there would be no real guantee that the current situation at Gama would be matched at TMC.
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Posts: 166
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 162
Yes thank you I did wrote a rebuttal about 3 post above this one stating that TMC would not have anything to with WUP. WUP will create their own airline . All WUP wanted was a certificate to operate 135 Charter. I Really question should be directed at WUP management not TMC crews anymore. TMC will be nothing more than what TWA was to American. A buyout! Maybe there personnel will remain in charge and if they do remain in charge under the WUP banner things may not be as kosher as we have it now a GAMA. Be WUP could come out with an industry leading work rules. No one will know til “they” want us to know.
#19
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: Back on the "light" side...
Posts: 193
Many, many question to be asked and hopefully answered in the not too distant future for sure....
We all know that Gama has several certificates under its umbrella and many thought it would be all consolidated by now but alas still operating independently. Will this news play a role in it, who knows? Gama has never had much in the way of overhead in terms of upper level management especially on the managed side. One or two guys having to wear many, many hats. It's a typical "mom and pop" operation wanting to play in the big time. Did Gama pay for the employees healthcare before they had WU?
We all know that Gama has several certificates under its umbrella and many thought it would be all consolidated by now but alas still operating independently. Will this news play a role in it, who knows? Gama has never had much in the way of overhead in terms of upper level management especially on the managed side. One or two guys having to wear many, many hats. It's a typical "mom and pop" operation wanting to play in the big time. Did Gama pay for the employees healthcare before they had WU?
#20
New Hire
Joined APC: Jun 2019
Posts: 1
I have worked for TMC for 2 years and there are some things I want to say because I’ve been a long time lurker but don’t really post. But many of my Gama friends have been spooked by the terrible stuff about TMC on the forums so I want to clear up some misunderstandings.
There are a LOT of butt hurt ex-TMC pilots that lurk on this forum, many of whom seem to wish the whole ship would sink. (And many who actively tried to sink it with bull**** maintenance write ups, fatigue calls, etc when they did work here) However, in the last year and a half, the new management has really turned things around. The pilots we have currently are a great group by in large and many of those who rightfully did have gripes with the old management are not around to see the way things have turned around, yet continue to try and tarnish the “reformed” TMC.
Much of the information posted on the forums about TMC has not caught up with reality. Last year, we got an increase in perdiem to $55/day ($65 international), increase to entire pay scale (year 1 FO pay based on 8/6 schedule is $276.44/day, goes up to $300.48 year 2). Company pays up to $200/yr for Uniforms, 11pm go home day guarantee or get paid full extra day, train on your days on, 16 days vacation with 5years or more seniority, major maintenance is in house again (and I can honestly say that reliability has increased because of it). A typical day is a 3 leg day but 2 leg days and 4 leg days are not rare either.
I have to admit, I was nervous when the teamsters went away, yet Duty on/off times remain, and minrest is pretty rare (and when it does happen, it’s usually because you’re doing or staging for a next day recovery flight), but with the new in house maintenance, and noticeably higher reliability rate, recovery flights have decreased dramatically as well (at least I don’t seem to be doing them as much anymore, I don’t have access to the actual statistics).
It sure will be interesting to see how the new WU relationship works out, but given Wheels Up’s reputation, I’m not too worried.
There are a LOT of butt hurt ex-TMC pilots that lurk on this forum, many of whom seem to wish the whole ship would sink. (And many who actively tried to sink it with bull**** maintenance write ups, fatigue calls, etc when they did work here) However, in the last year and a half, the new management has really turned things around. The pilots we have currently are a great group by in large and many of those who rightfully did have gripes with the old management are not around to see the way things have turned around, yet continue to try and tarnish the “reformed” TMC.
Much of the information posted on the forums about TMC has not caught up with reality. Last year, we got an increase in perdiem to $55/day ($65 international), increase to entire pay scale (year 1 FO pay based on 8/6 schedule is $276.44/day, goes up to $300.48 year 2). Company pays up to $200/yr for Uniforms, 11pm go home day guarantee or get paid full extra day, train on your days on, 16 days vacation with 5years or more seniority, major maintenance is in house again (and I can honestly say that reliability has increased because of it). A typical day is a 3 leg day but 2 leg days and 4 leg days are not rare either.
I have to admit, I was nervous when the teamsters went away, yet Duty on/off times remain, and minrest is pretty rare (and when it does happen, it’s usually because you’re doing or staging for a next day recovery flight), but with the new in house maintenance, and noticeably higher reliability rate, recovery flights have decreased dramatically as well (at least I don’t seem to be doing them as much anymore, I don’t have access to the actual statistics).
It sure will be interesting to see how the new WU relationship works out, but given Wheels Up’s reputation, I’m not too worried.