Trying to avoid being CFI, Options?
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2019
Position: baller, shot caller
Posts: 961
You probably don't want to hear this, but the best thing you can do right now is to stop taking out loans (if you are) and figure out a side hustle that will help you self finance your training as much as possible. Forget the whole "seniority is everything, get there first, you should've been hired yesterday" mentality and focus on making smart financial decisions, even if it means slowing down your training footprint. Also forget about lower time jobs hiring anyone with a pulse, the large hiring bonuses, fast upgrades and any of the other anomalies we've seen over the past few years. Those are long gone and for the time being. Get ready for the pain. I finished flight school during the Great Recession at 22 and averaged around 25k/year until I hit 30.
And to answer your question - just going off of past downturns, finishing flight school (CFI or no CFI) within the next year or so will probably land you a job at Chili's or UberEats. In other words it really won't matter much in the near term.
If teaching is something you enjoy, then do it. If not, then don't do it. Most importantly hang in there, this will cause short term pain but it will eventually rebound.
And to answer your question - just going off of past downturns, finishing flight school (CFI or no CFI) within the next year or so will probably land you a job at Chili's or UberEats. In other words it really won't matter much in the near term.
If teaching is something you enjoy, then do it. If not, then don't do it. Most importantly hang in there, this will cause short term pain but it will eventually rebound.
Last edited by SSlow; 05-09-2020 at 02:57 PM.
#22
Why short yourself and your development as a pilot?
I had the same mentality back when I was in your shoes. But once I did start teaching, I found that I was was pretty darn good at it, so you never know.
You'll never learn more about anything, including aviation/flying, than when you teach it.
I have flown with numerous different crew across numerous airframes throughout my 20+ years of flying jets.
The better pilots are always previous/current instructors.
If I had to choose between you and another guy to hire, all things equal between the two of you, I'd take the guy with some Instruction Given, any day of the week...
I had the same mentality back when I was in your shoes. But once I did start teaching, I found that I was was pretty darn good at it, so you never know.
You'll never learn more about anything, including aviation/flying, than when you teach it.
I have flown with numerous different crew across numerous airframes throughout my 20+ years of flying jets.
The better pilots are always previous/current instructors.
If I had to choose between you and another guy to hire, all things equal between the two of you, I'd take the guy with some Instruction Given, any day of the week...
#23
You can log SIC time under 135 (even if not required per the type certification) if it's in the OpSpec. Here's the AC if you are interested.
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/.../AC_135-43.pdf
I just learned about this during my online FIRC. Another interesting regulation change is instrument pilots can now log approaches in a simulator for currency without a CFII present.
https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/.../AC_135-43.pdf
I just learned about this during my online FIRC. Another interesting regulation change is instrument pilots can now log approaches in a simulator for currency without a CFII present.
If I were FAA or a potential employer I’d go after that with a vengeance.
I’ve turned down enough shady offers in my time.
Classic lol. I have 3 type ratings and 2600TT (peanuts compared to most here!!, yet still 10x your experience), was flying a large cabin biz jet from the left seat loving life. I'd now feel incredibly lucky to find a CFI job let alone a right seat turbine gig. How on earth do you plan on NOT instructing is beyond me. Triggered.
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 285
This article explains it pretty well.
https://www.boldmethod.com/learn-to-fly/regulations/your-guide-to-logging-sic-flight-time-in-single-pilot-airplanes/
I disagree that flying SIC with a MEI and logging it as dual recieved as being shady. I think that can be good experience.
I would say two pilots flying on a single pilot aircraft part 91 and having one person under the hood with neither pilot being a MEI so both could log PIC due to one being a safety pilot as shady.
https://www.boldmethod.com/learn-to-fly/regulations/your-guide-to-logging-sic-flight-time-in-single-pilot-airplanes/
I disagree that flying SIC with a MEI and logging it as dual recieved as being shady. I think that can be good experience.
I would say two pilots flying on a single pilot aircraft part 91 and having one person under the hood with neither pilot being a MEI so both could log PIC due to one being a safety pilot as shady.
#25
#26
On Reserve
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 23
It’s not shady to log it as dual received if dual was being received. Comes down to the straight-face test. If you’re logging a bunch of point-to-point flying as “dual received,” it does start to look suspicious, particularly if you never subsequently logged any non-dual flying in that type (implying that there was no end goal, there was nothing that you were actually being trained for).
#27
It’s not shady to log it as dual received if dual was being received. Comes down to the straight-face test. If you’re logging a bunch of point-to-point flying as “dual received,” it does start to look suspicious, particularly if you never subsequently logged any non-dual flying in that type (implying that there was no end goal, there was nothing that you were actually being trained for).
Contrary to popular belief “flight training” and “dual received” actually needs to have a purpose.
#28
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2014
Position: Phenom
Posts: 82
I agree with you on the logging dual, but there are a lot of King Air 350’s, CJ’s, and Phenoms being operated Pt 91 by pilots who aren’t single pilot typed. In that case, the other pilot can log SIC time legally as they are a required crew member. Just because the aircraft was certified SP doesn’t mean every pilot who flies one is typed to do so.
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2020
Posts: 119
If you log it legally and a future employer doesn't accept it then what? Also when a company says you can legally log it and claims to have the ops spec. Did you see the ops spec or just take their word for it? Regardless your goal as a pilot is to move on so technically either the future company accepts the time or they don't. Period.
#30
So about 20 hours into my training, I know a while to go! But given my financial and worldly circumstances I never thought it would be possible yet here I am! If everything goes to schedule I should have my commercial multi by November. Anyways it seems like most new pilots are destined to be CFIs to built time but I don’t want to do that. I would like to save that money and also, being a CFI is something that you need to be passionate about and while I’m passionate about flying I’m not as passionate about teaching. Is it possible to get hired by a 135 right out of flight school? I live in South Florida and wouldn’t mind flying caravans around the bahamas What are my other options/road to be able to get to 135 ASAP.
"CFI to built time, I don't want to do that, I'm not passionate about teaching."
Good think the people that are teaching you right now, are. Also, what about if/when you upgrade to captain? Isn't part of your job description to mentor your first Officer, especially at the regional level?
You "wouldn't mind flying a caravan around the bahamas" with your 20 hours? Well guess what? Thousands of highly qualified ATP pilots with thousands of hours soon won't mind either. I'll bet the majority have their CFIs too!
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