Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Part 135
King Air 200 windshield question >

King Air 200 windshield question

Notices
Part 135 Part 135 commercial operators

King Air 200 windshield question

Old 12-26-2009, 02:14 PM
  #1  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
BushwickBill's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: BE-20 PIC
Posts: 141
Default King Air 200 windshield question

Our windshield failed today. No one was hurt and overall it was uneventful yet highly unnerving.

The windshield is cracked so badly you can't see through it and there is at least one spot where the cracks are on the inside. Small flakes of plexi glass are on the glare shield.

Apparently the maintenance shop says it is cool to ferry the aircraft unpressurized to a different airport.

I think this seems like an unnecessary risk. Also I can't imagine that the aircraft would be legal to fly even if it is safe.

What do you guys think? Does anyone have any particulars on if the aircraft is still airworthy?


Thanks
BushwickBill is offline  
Old 12-26-2009, 02:25 PM
  #2  
Gets Weekends Off
 
pokey9554's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: Cessna 150
Posts: 655
Default

Which window is it? Obtaining a ferry permit can be window dependent.

Often we have to ferry aircraft with cracked windshields to an airport where it can be repaired. In a nutshell, a ferry permit allows you to fly a non-airworthy airplane which has been deemed safe by an A&P. The A&P who was called out to the airplane should take care of all the paperwork. If you fly for a 135 operator, the end result will be an open write up in the maintenance log with a ferry permit stapled to it.
pokey9554 is offline  
Old 12-26-2009, 07:49 PM
  #3  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: 737 Left
Posts: 1,824
Default Ferry Permit

What he said. Get a ferry permit or fix it prior to flying it.
AtlCSIP is offline  
Old 12-27-2009, 04:41 AM
  #4  
Line Holder
 
Gypsy Pilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: 320 Left
Posts: 95
Default

The Limitations section spells out what is tolerable for a cracked windshield. Keep in mind that these limitations vary from model to model and even inside the 200 model. I pulled this from an A200CT manual. It sounds like you need a ferry permit.

1-10B
CRACKED OR SHATTERED WINDSHIELD
The following limitations apply when continued flight is required with a cracked outer or inner ply of the windshield.

1. Continued flight with a cracked windshield is limited to 25 hours.
2. Windshields which have a shattered inner ply will have numerous cracks which will obstruct forward vision and may produce small particles or flakes of glass that can break free of the windshield and interfere with the crews vision. These windshields must be replaced prior to the next flight unless a special flight permit is obtained from the local Flight Standards District Office.
3. Crack(s) must not impair visibility.
4. Crack(s) must not interfere with the use of windshield wipers for flights requiring the use of wipers.
5. Windshield anti ice must be operational for flights into icing conditions.
6. The following placard must be installed in clear view of the pilot.
MAXIMUM AIRPLANE ALTITUDE IS LIMITED TO 25,000. CABIN DIFF. PRESSURE MUST BE MAINTAINED BETWEEN 2.0 AND 4.6 PSI DURING FLIGHT.
Windshields that have cracks in both the inner and outer plies must be replaced prior to the next flight unless a special flight permit is obtained from the local Flight Standards District Office.
Gypsy Pilot is offline  
Old 12-27-2009, 07:34 AM
  #5  
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
 
BushwickBill's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: BE-20 PIC
Posts: 141
Default

Thanks guys. I found some additional information in the limitations section of the POH.
BushwickBill is offline  
Old 12-27-2009, 09:48 AM
  #6  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 162
Default

The King Air windshields tend to de-laminate too. I have heard that they do that if you turn on the windshield heat after the glass has become cold soaked.
Anyone else experienced this?
Is there any harm in turning it on low after take off if we know that icing conditions are expected?
chongololo is offline  
Old 12-27-2009, 06:08 PM
  #7  
Line Holder
 
Gypsy Pilot's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: 320 Left
Posts: 95
Default

Originally Posted by chongololo View Post
The King Air windshields tend to de-laminate too. I have heard that they do that if you turn on the windshield heat after the glass has become cold soaked.
Anyone else experienced this?
Is there any harm in turning it on low after take off if we know that icing conditions are expected?

I'm not aware of any issues with turning the heat on early. Company policy is that the heat comes on at 10K or the freezing level, whichever happens first. I don't think there's a mechanical penalty for being more conservative than that.
Applying heat to a cold soaked window can crack it as well as cause delamination.

GP
Gypsy Pilot is offline  
Old 12-29-2009, 09:04 AM
  #8  
On Reserve
 
GWW5's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Position: King Air 200, Captain
Posts: 23
Default

Yep, happened a few times to me. The last time we were climbing through about 22K on our way to Iwo Jima from Atsugi. But it wasn't because we put it on late, ie at altitude. I have a great picture of it. Also had one instance where the maintainers put the wrong bolts through as well which became a causal factor to the failure.

As a general practice we the Navy put ours on passing 10K.

If I can figure out how to post the pic I will or if someone can help me that would be great.
GWW5 is offline  
Old 12-29-2009, 03:04 PM
  #9  
Flying Farmer
 
Ewfflyer's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Turbo-props' and John Deere's
Posts: 3,160
Default

Originally Posted by GWW5 View Post
If I can figure out how to post the pic I will or if someone can help me that would be great.
You'll need to host it on another site, APC doesn't allow attachments

On Topic: Definately go with what the Mx Manual says, and I'd be 99.9999% certain I wouldn't do it without a Ferry Permit. Always CYA!!!
Ewfflyer is offline  
Old 01-10-2010, 08:34 AM
  #10  
Apteryx
 
Oldog's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Posts: 127
Default

Originally Posted by BushwickBill View Post
Our windshield failed today. No one was hurt and overall it was uneventful yet highly unnerving.

The windshield is cracked so badly you can't see through it and there is at least one spot where the cracks are on the inside. Small flakes of plexi glass are on the glare shield.

Apparently the maintenance shop says it is cool to ferry the aircraft unpressurized to a different airport.

I think this seems like an unnecessary risk. Also I can't imagine that the aircraft would be legal to fly even if it is safe.

What do you guys think? Does anyone have any particulars on if the aircraft is still airworthy?


Thanks
This sometimes happens to the pressurized Beech turboprops. Usually the windshield develops a crack, sometimes herringbone pattern cracks, and sometimes it appears like "crazing" and pretty well obscures the view. There are specific limits for ferrying the airplane -- pressurization differential, etc., and advice is available from Beech, Raytheon, Hawker Beechcraft (or whatever they're calling themselves this week). Sometimes limits are even published in the MEL, with specific limitations. Usually damage must be confined to the inner or outer pane of the windshield. They're glass, incidentally, except in rare cases where the airplane is not approved for flight in icing.
Oldog is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
mattp1803
Corporate
49
10-14-2011 06:05 AM
wareagle07
Hiring News
3
08-10-2009 07:30 AM
Sbaker1595
Corporate
47
12-18-2008 08:09 AM
Bryan1726
Corporate
15
10-28-2008 08:49 AM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Your Privacy Choices