Citation V
 

One of our management clients is looking at upgrading from a B200 and has his eye on a Citation V.

Any thoughts on them? Interested in costs per hour if anyone has them, especially related to a II or Bravo (we have one of each currently).

Not to get off topic but how do you like your II ? I am trying to convince our owner to go from a Cheyenne to an SII

It's been a good plane for us. Had it about six years. We fly the hell out of it. Not sure it'd be a good one-to-one for a Cheyenne unless you're regularly stretching the legs on the Cheyenne...the II really drinks the gas on the short hops.


If you need any specifics about it drop me a PM.

When you compare a Bravo to a V your kind of comparing apples to oranges. What I mean by that is that a Bravo is really a new II. If you want to compare apples to apples you should compare between the Ultra and the V. But I do have to say, I do love the Bravo. Trailing link gear and electric flaps are the two main differences. Also if you ever get stuck at an airport without Jet A the Bravo CANNOT burn 100ll but the ultra,II, and V can. The Bravo cruises at 380 knots. You shoot approaches in about the 135 knot range. Bravo's are usually more expensive because the were made around 2000. Oh yah the best thing of all about the Ultra and the Bravo is it is a all glass cockpit. Sorry for my rambling. If you wanna know anything in particular just ask.

I would consider the Citation Encore 560, not to be confused with the Excel 560. It is in the family of the CE-500 type ratings. The Encore is a great machine. FLight plan at 420KTAS. It has trailing link gear and a heated leading edge, a pleasure to fly and a very capable airplane. Just my .02

A V is a good airplane. The only down-side is the age of the avionics if no upgrades have taken place. Even with a up-dated FMS you still aren't going to
be able to couple to VNAV or WAAS approaches. Honeywell doesn't seem to
interested in making these old avionics interface with anything newer.
Put a V into FltPlan.com and look at fuel burn numbers. As with any old airframe it's previous life has a big effect on current costs.
Dave

I can speak from personal experience. The Bravo is a dream to fly, and to fly on. The CE-560 series (V, Ultra, Encore) is a true 6 to 7 person airplane. The CE-550 (II, Bravo) is configured to seat 6 or 7 passengers (depending on configuration), and is extremely cramped. The CE-560 has many benefits that the CE-550 does not. It sports a higher useful load as well as a range approximately 200sm (plus) greater then the CE-550. The CE-560 cruises 20-30 knots faster then the CE-550. The variable and fixed operating costs are nearly identical between the two series, due to the fact that most, if not all parts, and maintenance programs are the same (except for the engines, as they are more expensive to purchase initially on the CE-560). Both aircraft perform very well in high, hot, and short field conditions. All in all, she’s a great plane. Your boss is making a great decision.

What type of flying does your boss want to do with the plane?

I have a few hundred hours on the Bravo. I did not like the winshield de-ice (bleed air). Very inefficient at idle and very noisy at high power settings.

I also thought the ride was pretty bumpy in turbulence (light aircraft, huge wing = low wing loading, bumpy ride)

It has leading edge boots but that never was much of a problem. Landings (and flying in general) are easy, systems are simple, avionics ok, but cheap/poor radios.

Don't go for a Bravo if you plan on carrying more than 4 or 5 adults on a regular basis.

Think I might have not worded my initial post the best,

We currently operate both a II and Bravo. The owner of one of our King Airs is wanting an upgrade and picked out this particular V. He's not choosing between a V, II, and Bravo.

Thanks for the help though guys, keep it coming!

I would expect the V to be very similar to the II with regards to pro's and con's and only slightly higher opearting costs. It is now a fairly old airframe with all the straight wing Citation disadvantegs includings some that they have fixed on later models (gear, de-ice, avionics etc). I am sure it can provide good service if you get a good one at a decent price. As always you get what you pay for and of course an Encore+ is much nicer. Or an XL/XLS/XLS+. I know that wasn't the question, though ;-)

Seeing that he wants to upgrade from a King Air I wonder if he will be happy to have a smaller cabin cross section. I really think an XL would be a much nicer upgrade if he can afford it. Or stick with the 200. A great aircraft for shorter routes where the extra speed of the jet won't make much of a difference.