Les Habitants

Hey everyone,

As stated in the title, I am a 300 hour, MIFR rated pilot north of 49. I am a dual citizen, and would like to move down to the states to fly, to be closer to my gf, who lives in Georgia, and I was wondering what my prospects would look like?

The job pickings in Canada are pretty slim. It's not uncommon to work on the ground as a rampie throwing bags, or answering phones before the company you work for will give you a shot at the cockpit. The good thing is, you get a job in a turbine aircraft right off the bat-king air, metro, etc. I am working the ground at a reputable company that flies Metros, and will likely get my chance sometime in the next year to move up, however, nothing is guarenteed-it's very competitive here.

I have relatively little knowledge of what the career ladder looks like in the States-can anyone shed some light on that for me?
My understanding is a low time pilot has to CFI, tow banners, or drop skydivers until they have enough time to move on. "Moving on" is what I am unclear about, where do pilots go after towing banners or CFI'ing? Do they move on to part 135 or on to the regionals? How many hours do you need before you can get hired at a part 135 op? Are there other ways to get the time necessary to move up to the majors?

Sorry if I sound a little bit dumb, but the system is slightly different in Canada. We don't have "part 91" or "part 135" etc. Our commercial operations are divided into air taxi, commuter, and airline categories. Our "Air Taxi" category would be equal to your "part 135" category. It's most common for new pilots like me who choose not to instruct to start as a right-seater with an air operator (usually certified in the "Air Taxi" category) which allows us to build time, and eventually move up to a captains job, or a FO job on a bigger plane in the "commuter category" (which is defined as any aircraft with 10-19 seats with a Max Takeoff Weight of 19000 lbs or less).


Feel free to PM me if that's more convenient!
Thanks!

LH

Cubdriver

Welcome to APC, Les. You are not going to be able to find a job doing much of anything with 300 hours in the present market. Your best bet is to get the FAA Certified Flight Instructor (CFI), Instrument Instructor (CFII), Multiengine Instructor (MEI) certifications and find a job teaching people to fly. Not that anyone wants these tickets, it's just that unless you have a ton of money to use buying your flight hours most people have to earn the flight time and this is how most pilots do it. You mentioned some of the entry level commercial jobs and it is true that certain jobs only require about 500 hours to start. Aerial tours, skydiver flying, banner tow and pipeline patrol are a few of those jobs. However you are almost certainly not going to be able to find one of those jobs where your girlfriend lives, and even if you do these jobs are often seasonal and slow a lot of the time.

So, seriously consider getting the flight tickets to enable you to teach. The side benefit of adding the teaching certs is they make you a better pilot and make your resume look good so that when you get to about 1300 hours, which is the starting point for Part 135 jobs, you are competitive. With 300 hours you cannot fly Part 135 because only a few operations have permits allowing low time pilots (500 is the lowest hour figure), and almost none of those jobs are hiring at that number even though it is legal. Your best bet is to teach and with some luck there is a place to do it near your girlfriend's house. It will be expensive getting those tickets though.

A few years ago there was a shortage of entry level pilots in the US and the regionals did hire pilots with as little as 400 hours for a while. There were a bunch of problems with that, such as that almost nobody can keep up with a jet having so little flight experience, and they tended to drop out of training which is very bad for a resume. At any rate the hiring mins for regional jobs now hover around 1000 hours total and about 250 multiengine. That would be the low end of it, and the better jobs have higher minimums- say 1500 hours and about 500 multiengine. In addition, Congress is going to raise the minimum for regional airline pilots to 1500 hours anyway, so the point is moot.

The typical path for new pilots is to teach for a few years (2-3) to get to Part 135 minimums, then fly night freight or charter in a Part 135 operation for a couple more years, then apply to regional airlines and see what they can get with about 2000 hours. Good luck. The weather is warm here.

LR2205

I'm not picking on you cub, because it is true. HOWEVER, this is a huge problem with today's aviation industry that needs to be addressed- the way which we train our new pilots. Its's so sad that the prividelge of teaching others to fly has been degraded by being handed to those who don't want or deserve the job. The FAA should address this issue.

Sorry to go off topic, but i just don't feel that one should instruct is he/she does not really want to.

Cubdriver

Actually I take the criticism, because I disapprove of that mentality of "I'm just doing this for the flight time and I do not care how well I teach" so often seen among new instructors. But the truth is, almost everyone first thinks "how can I possibly get around having teach before I get my first good job". Knowing this, I wanted to speak to Les on the level he is on now. Poor guy is looking at an uphill battle to get his hours. I do encourage anyone who teaches to take pride in it and try their best to be enriched by the experience. I am still teaching after more than 3 years and it clearly was not a bridge job in my case. Most pilots are in the end are improved by the experience, however slow they are to realize it.

Les Habitants

Thanks for the welcome and info Cub!

I am unclear as to the nature of Part 135...what exactly does this mean? I have a vague idea but I am not totally sure. Does it pay better than the regionals? (Here in Canada typical FO starting pay is about 27000-we often talk poorly of the US regionals and their low pay). Also, can you go straight from a Part 135 operation to the majors, or do you have to go through the regionals?

Currently, I am working in a reservations office waiting my turn to get a chance at flying the metro (which is the plane we fly for)...not bad for a first flying gig eh? But that's the way it is in Canada. So it would seem to be best to wait it out on the ground until I get in the right seat and build up as much time as I can. I would imagine 1500 hours of multi turbine time in a metro is more competitive than 1500 hours of flight instructing time.

I don't have a degree, it's not necessary in Canada (very few pilots have degrees). How is this going to bode for me?

Sorry for all the seemingly dumb questions, I am just trying to learn the US system.

Thanks again,
LH

Cubdriver

"Part 135" refers to a section of the US Code of Federal Regulations (CFR for short) Federal Aviation Administration (FAA for short) governing rules applicable to all aviation operations in the United States. A citation for the Part 135 rules would appear as "14CFR FAR 135.XXX" where XXX is the subpart. The Part 135 section is particularly meant for smaller aircraft used mostly for charter and light commercial applications. Part 135 operations include light freight carriage, light passenger carriage, and other forms of light air transport. It is not to be confused with regional, major, or large cargo aircraft which fall under the Part 121 rules. Bear in mind this is just my explanation of it, and you should consult other sources for a more exact definition.

Part 135 typically pays about as much as regional airline work. First year regional airline work is notoriously low paying (ballpark $20,000) but the pay scale goes up pretty fast from there, and maxes out around $65k-$75k at most regional airlines. There are published numbers available by aircraft type through the NBAA (National Business Aviation Association) for Part 135 jobs because they vary so much.

There is no rule against graduating from a Part 135 job directly to the majors, but given the high number of competitors for few jobs the more typical path is by way of the regional airlines first. The deciding issue would be turbine PIC hours, but there are other metrics used in the application.

Others at APC can decide this issue for you better than I can, but I would stay in my position as a Metro pilot if I managed to get there. Pick up flight instructing on the side to enrich your resume and add experience in other airplanes. Turbine multiengine PIC is valuable to the US airlines. Be careful however, that if you get stuck in the right seat of the Metro you are not logging PIC, you are logging SIC which is not as valuable.

Not well. You may be able to find employment at a US regional airlines without college, but you will be limited from applying to US major airlines unless a serious pilot shortage occurs.

Les Habitants

I can't get a job instructing-instrucing time is considered extremely invaluble in canada-because I don't have my instructor rating, and I am not able to find the 8000 dollars to do it. Plus I'll be flying about 1000 hours per year, and the max you're allowed to fly here is 1200.


So I hear. My plan is to do a distance ed degree slowly over the next few years. Hopefully this will cover it for me....How does a diploma do?

thanks for all the help cub! I really really appreciate it!

Les Habitants

Another question for you Cub,

How long are the upgrade times from FO to Capt usually at a place like Pinnacle or ASA?

I got on the Metro up here in Canada about 2 months ago, and have over 500 hours now. I am still hoping to build about the necessary hours and try and get on with a regional somewhere down south in a year or so.

snippercr

Congrats on the Metro job! You have the hard part out of the way - a source of multi-engine time. Regionals do not care if it is SIC or PIC time, just the fact that is multi engine time. The other good thing is since your last post, minimums are airlines have come down a bit. Most places are at 1000 hours with some even looking at sub 1000 hours.

Is Georgia still your goal?

Les Habitants

Thanks! I am very fortunate indeed. I'm doing about 80 hours a month, and just passed 500, so it won't take me too long to get to 1000. How about age? Are they flexible on that? A lot of places say you have to be 21 (I'm just about there...).

Yes, Georgia still is my goal, and in my current situation I can afford to be picky, however...for the right job, I can be flexible!