Disqualifed For Initial Medical
03-22-2011, 05:32 AM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Math Teacher
Posts: 2,273
Disqualifed For Initial Medical
Good morning:
On Tuesday, March 15, 2011, @ approx 3:52 pm in the afternoon, I got a call from the HIMS AME in Vero Beach, FL, XXX XXX, who was willing to sponsor me in the HIMS program told me that although I had met all of the criteria that the FAA had set for the conditions of the HIMS program, that I would still be denied a medical because the FAA said that I had an anti-social personality disorder. This is in spite of the recommendations of two HIMS evaluators, Dr. XXX XXX and Dr. XXX XXX, a neuro-psychologist and a neuro-psychiatrist respectively, that I be medically certified, 3rd class, to start my flight training. Their diagnosis was that any characteristic traits of the personality disorder where non-existant due to my abstinence from alcohol abuse and that with further supervision, I could apply for a higher class medical in 12-16 months. I thought that I was finally on my way.
Dr. XXX informed me that he had been on the phone with the doctors in Washington DC for the last 1 1/2 weeks. This includes XXX and XXX. He said that he posed the question as to why would they allow me to continue on in this process knowing that they would in the end deny me on the basis of an anit-social personality disorder. He said that he got no reasonable answer.
The thing that gets me is that if the doctors in DC knew from the time that I got my initial denial letter from the Federal Air Surgeon in May of 2009 that an anti-social personality disorder was in fact a permanent disqualifer, why was I led to believe that by meeting the criteria for the HIMS SI was all that I needed to do? I have spent the last 3 years of my time, effort and resources pursuing this. I'm considering having an attorney looking into the fact to see if in fact the FAA intentionally mislead me to believe that I would be certified. Every correspondence that I got after the initial denial letter was aimed at the HIMS (SI) process and the criteria that had to met. There was never anything mentioned about antisocial personality disorder and it being a permanent disqualifier. Absolutely nothing.
So, as a long standing member of APC, this will probably be my last post for some time. I wanna thank everyone for their support and advice. For me, aviation has strictly become a hobby. The quest to become a paid pilot is over.
Blue skies.
Marcus
(atpwannabe)
On Tuesday, March 15, 2011, @ approx 3:52 pm in the afternoon, I got a call from the HIMS AME in Vero Beach, FL, XXX XXX, who was willing to sponsor me in the HIMS program told me that although I had met all of the criteria that the FAA had set for the conditions of the HIMS program, that I would still be denied a medical because the FAA said that I had an anti-social personality disorder. This is in spite of the recommendations of two HIMS evaluators, Dr. XXX XXX and Dr. XXX XXX, a neuro-psychologist and a neuro-psychiatrist respectively, that I be medically certified, 3rd class, to start my flight training. Their diagnosis was that any characteristic traits of the personality disorder where non-existant due to my abstinence from alcohol abuse and that with further supervision, I could apply for a higher class medical in 12-16 months. I thought that I was finally on my way.
Dr. XXX informed me that he had been on the phone with the doctors in Washington DC for the last 1 1/2 weeks. This includes XXX and XXX. He said that he posed the question as to why would they allow me to continue on in this process knowing that they would in the end deny me on the basis of an anit-social personality disorder. He said that he got no reasonable answer.
The thing that gets me is that if the doctors in DC knew from the time that I got my initial denial letter from the Federal Air Surgeon in May of 2009 that an anti-social personality disorder was in fact a permanent disqualifer, why was I led to believe that by meeting the criteria for the HIMS SI was all that I needed to do? I have spent the last 3 years of my time, effort and resources pursuing this. I'm considering having an attorney looking into the fact to see if in fact the FAA intentionally mislead me to believe that I would be certified. Every correspondence that I got after the initial denial letter was aimed at the HIMS (SI) process and the criteria that had to met. There was never anything mentioned about antisocial personality disorder and it being a permanent disqualifier. Absolutely nothing.
So, as a long standing member of APC, this will probably be my last post for some time. I wanna thank everyone for their support and advice. For me, aviation has strictly become a hobby. The quest to become a paid pilot is over.
Blue skies.
Marcus
(atpwannabe)
Last edited by atpwannabe; 03-22-2011 at 08:48 AM. Reason: Good luck... edited out names
03-22-2011, 07:03 AM
#4
Does NOT get weekends off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: ERJ - 145
Posts: 1,631
I feel your pain. I applied 2 years in a row to the Air Force Academy and was DQd for some anti-depressants I took freshmen year in HS. I had to apply a second time since the waiver process took so long that I never got it finished in time for the first year. After multi doctors visits, calls, letter writing, etc I was finally told "History of a Mood Disorder" was permanently disqualifying with no chance of a waiver.
I know the frustration and outrage you must feel, having been given the run around only to be told it was predetermined from the start.
I would say keep at it. It is probably hopeless (and you probably realize this) but if you try showing that you do not have anti-social behavior (hell, we're pilots) maybe you can try getting that 3rd class and maybe even second/first. Keep at it.
I know the frustration and outrage you must feel, having been given the run around only to be told it was predetermined from the start.
I would say keep at it. It is probably hopeless (and you probably realize this) but if you try showing that you do not have anti-social behavior (hell, we're pilots) maybe you can try getting that 3rd class and maybe even second/first. Keep at it.
03-22-2011, 07:03 AM
#5
Moderator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: ATP, CFI etc.
Posts: 6,056
We feel your pain. Many of us here have been thrown out of a race a time or two as well, and in the end the world is not always fair. We win a few and we lose a few, and that's life. The challenge is to see if we can find meaning in the experience. Our nature as human beings is to have a dream, but there are many ways to have a dream and professional piloting is simply one of them. I would continue to purse your appeal. Don't hate yourself for your having wanted something good for yourself. That part they can never take away.
03-22-2011, 08:09 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: A-320 FO
Posts: 693
There is a good read on this issue, and it can be done. The piece begins on page 5:
http://www.faa.gov/library/reports/m...00504a_web.pdf
http://www.faa.gov/library/reports/m...00504a_web.pdf
03-23-2011, 02:15 AM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: 744 CA
Posts: 4,772
Getting an attorney will likely be just throwing good money after bad. I suspect somewher.e buried in the FAA Med regs it states that this condition is permanently DQing. Good luck in your future no matter what you decide to to. If you truly love aviation there are other professions in the aviation world which might be appealing to you.
03-23-2011, 06:12 AM
#9
Administrator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: C-172
Posts: 8,024
I am very sorry to hear this. We have been following your progress, trials and tribulations over the years, and this is just heartbreaking.
According to the FAA (Pilot Medical Certification Questions and Answers), a personality disorder is disqualifying, but only if "severe enough to have repeatedly manifested itself by overt acts."
Who has the burden of proof that someone does not have a disqualifying disorder? When does the burden of proof shift? Is there an appeal process?
According to the FAA (Pilot Medical Certification Questions and Answers), a personality disorder is disqualifying, but only if "severe enough to have repeatedly manifested itself by overt acts."
Who has the burden of proof that someone does not have a disqualifying disorder? When does the burden of proof shift? Is there an appeal process?
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