Help & advice for the new guy!
 

Didn't see a thread specific to the new guy coming in looking for advice. I'm completely new to 121 operations - coming from general aviation, nothing commercial. What advice can anyone give us newbies to help us out? I have the ATP-CTP coming up in February, then starting FO training afterwards. I've posted elsewhere and received advice on studying Sheppard Air for the ATP - any other recommendations? Best strategies to pass ATP and FO training? What can we expect our days to be like at both? Any recommendations on how to survive? And pass! I'm looking forward to joining the airlines and paying my dues in the regionals! Thanks to everyone for posting info here. From a newbie perspective, this has been a wealth of knowledge.

When's your class date?


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Show up to class, study what they tell you to study, ?????, Profit

In addition to studying for your ATP/CTP, spend time studying and reviewing your limitations and immediate action items. Those are the 2 things that you will be expected to know from day 1 until you leave PSA. They can make/break a check ride or recurrent training. Can’t emphasize the above advice enough...

Tbh the fact that you're even making the effort to find this stuff out indicates that you'll be fine in training.

Only two things to do really. Remember that the ctp class is entirely separate from your training and is all about passing the atp written. Do Shepherd air, the in class time does not cover anything relevant to the test whatsoever and is more of a formality/primer for 121 ops.

Second, just make sure you come to your training class with the limitations and flows memorized. The flows don't have to be perfect, it's sort of hard to visualize it until you're sitting in front of a mock cockpit anyway. Just get the general idea. If you do this, training will be much easier. It's 100% possible to show up day 1 with no prep and pass, but those guys were stretched pretty thin between going to class, and then studying back at the hotel. They were stressing out about being able to keep up the pace of training. Don't put yourself through that. Meanwhile, I barely opened the books to study during training because I already got it done. It's alot more enjoyable to come back and crack a beer with your Sim partner then come back and crack open the books because you're behind.

I'd be willing to bet you'll be surprised how simple it is when you get there. I stressed out about it, got there, and realized it wasn't actually that bad, and the horror stories were just propagated by people who didn't put the work in on their end to prepare.


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The only thing that I will add is to be sure not to forget everything that you have learned as a pilot up to now. If you have time, go back and take a look over basic instrument or commercial topics if you are weak in those areas.

I am hesitant to give you too many things to look at, because if will overwhelm you and is not 100% necessary, but if you have a long wait and want to be well prepared, here are a few things you can do.


Jeppesen has a great video collection (free) on how to use their charts. That is worth a few hours of watching. FREE Aviation Charting Webinar Event Series - Fly Like an Insider with Chart Clinic Confidential | Jeppesen

If you have never flown a turbine airplane, then Turbine Pilots Flight Manual is a good resource. Just getting a basic idea of how turbine engines work, bleed air/hydraulic systems, TRU's, and the like will help things a little bit.

Everything Explained for the Professional Pilot is a great book for looking over airline rules and regulations.


Again, don't stress out and try to memorize all of these. Study before hand (limitations and memory items!), be ready for the ATP written, and go in with a willingness to learn.

I'm heading to class at the end of Feb so here is what I’m doing..

1) Jepp videos referenced above
2) Purchased Jepp charts manual
3) Studying Shep for written - Planning to be done studying before class starts.

4) Flying as much as possible to include fast as possible approaches and holding
5) Planning a few sim hours in a G1000 panel before starting class
6) Buy - Everything Explained for the Professional Pilot – Fantastic resource as mentioned above

I second the turbine pilots flight manual, not as something to study, but something to just read casually just to get a taste of what’s coming


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Thanks for all the great tips! I appreciate it.

Also, do not argue with the instructors. This isn't flight school where the local CFIs are sitting around jaw jacking about the best way to do a lazy 8. In ground, you'll hear "PSA Pay, PSA Way." Do it the way the schoolhouse tells you. Arguing is the quickest way to get sent out the door. Previous 121 guys are susceptible to this problem so you have an advantage. You are nothing and know nothing at this stage. Once you get on the line, you'll figure it out how it's done. The good thing is you'll have good people working with you who will show you how the real world works. This can be said for any airline, really.

Not to throw a rain cloud on an otherwise useful thread with good advice......But:

Your background, general aviation only with no commercial, tend to have the hardest time on IOE. Don't let this be you! If you have your own plane, go fly IFR. Doesn't have to be actual IFR just go out and do some work at a busy airport. Talk to approach, shoot some ILS, maybe fly into some airports you are less comfortable with. Fly the approaches FAST. Get used to the speed at which things work in the en-route environment while flying 250kts vs 90kts.

This is where people are struggling. Anyone can study enough to pass orals, sims etc. It's the real world stuff that might hang you up.

Good luck, welcome aboard. See you on the line.

This^. Even after IOE there's a learning curve.

Meh

The FAA says you're qualified to be there PSA says you're qualified to be there that's all that matters... all the rest is chest puffing ego stroking little man syndrome.

Jeppesen articles
 

You might also check out these articles, Jeppesen Chart Clinic. They are essentially two page articles on different aspects of their charts. craigmorton.com/ifr/

Cooperate-Graduate, that’s the name of the game. Also take time to get to know your classmates. One thing you’ll hear, if your partner is dead weight it’s going to drag you down. I was very fortunate to have a partner who was just as driven as I was, and we did very well. Another classmate had a partner who went home every weekend, never studied with him, and they both struggled. Study as a group, you’ll be surprised how much you’ll learn from others that you missed or didn’t catch in class. It’s as fun as you make it! Good luck.

No commercial experience? No 135? No 91? Wow, very surprised with how the competition is you got in somehow. Where you at the right place at the right time or what? Good for you! The transition should be this easy for everyone.

whoops, didn't catch this is such an old thread. Ha, clicked on it in related threads without catching it.

PSA Bases
 

Does anyone know when PSA will advise which base one gets. Do we know before training starts?

No. During training, once your name appears on FLICA, you bid what you want. Philly and DCA is where everyone new is going.

You'll know about a month and 1 week into training.

Ok thanks. DCA is where I want to go so hopefully that works out.
How many sim sessions are required for a non type rated pilot during training (FO)?

10 sims in prep for MV. Then LOFT prep (ground), and 1 LOFT sim.

Curious questions...

If you need extra Sims... How much hours extra are you provided?

Where do people request extra sim hours the most? I assume for MV?

What happens after Loft? Is it one ride in a real plane with a line check airman doing a visual approach, then you're all on your own?

Can’t tell you much about Sims, but IOE is actually flying the line with an LCA while you get comfortable in the actual airplane.


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No ride in the airplane with a check airman doing visual approaches. As soon as you finish in sims, you are in the airplane with 76 people seated behind you that paid for those seats. if you get lucky, you may never even fly an actual visual approach in your first block of IOE time. Nothing like shooting an ILS to minimums in your first day in the actual airplane. LOL.

As far as needing extra sims, that is up to the discretion of the training department. Most people do not need extra sims. If you are very close and just need an extra sim or 2, they will likely give it to you. But it will show up on your "permanent record" (PRIA), so I wouldn't expect extra sims. 10 is more than enough.

With regard to sims, if you’re new to 121 and the CRJ, you ARE going to feel behind. Just get used to it. If the instructors are moving you through the syllabus, even if you don’t feel like you have everything 100%, I tell guys that’s because a good instructor knows where you should be at any given point, and if they’re satisfied, they’re going to keep you moving. Trust the instructors.

Once you get out to the airplane, it can get a lot easier, because the airplane is a lot easier to fly than the sim, and it’s when all this stuff you learned by wrote in the sim starts to make sense in context of line operations.

I know there’s been some rumors about instructors and the training program on this board, and while not having any first hand knowledge to that effect, in our current staffing crisis is makes ZERO sense for rouge instructors to be randomly hard on people for kicks.

Come prepared, do the work, be ready to learn and take instruction, and trust where your instructors are leading you. You CAN do this.


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The main thing is, come prepared and have your flows, procedures, and callouts down cold. This is something you can work on every day, outside of the sims. If you can unconsciously spout your callouts, it’s one less thing to worry about. If you’re not to this level, you will have to think too hard, which will take away from your focus on controlling the aircraft. Something we see often is people rushing to do things. Be purposely slow and methodical. There’s very few things that need to be rushed in a jet. And if you make one mistake or get something out of order because you were rushing, then it’s hard to get back in your groove. Get it right the first time.
Secondly, always work to stay ahead of the airplane. Always be thinking “what’s next”. If you’re not thinking about that, you’re already behind. Things move twice as quick in a jet, so this is vitally important.
Your instructors will give you the tools you need when it comes to maneuver skills. Once again, know your procedures, but let the instructors teach the skills.

I’ll second most of this. Before I was flying the CRJ I got about 850 hours in a Chieftain at ungodly hours single pilot. Other aspects of that job aside, the CRJ is SO much easier to fly and manage once you understand this. Losing an engine in a piston single is way more work and more things to screw up than a modern jet.

I’d also argue that even though the airspeed, altitude, and vertical speed numbers are much bigger in the jet, if you know what’s coming the big numbers don’t matter much. I was doing the LDA Z 19 into DCA the other day, and the tower tried to fit too many departures ahead of us. Passing the Kennedy Center it was apparent we may have a situation, but I quickly briefed the callouts on the missed, and when the inevitable GA came it was a nonevent and kinda cool.

Just another day at the Office.

Best advice I ever got learning those kinda things is realize that a GA is just a TO with a running start. Ditto SE GA and a V1 Cut. ‘Soft’ GAs can be a little trickier, but that’s when you just pretend it’s Anthony Edwards beside you and think to yourself “time to do some of that pilot sh*t, Mav…..”

Easier with some time in the seat, sure, but just fly the airplane.


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Once you get to a airline that isn’t talking heavy like PSA… the callouts are much easier…..

But everything else you said is on point.

This is all good info. I am coming as an E3 pilot (FO) due to no time in US part 121 but have flown 30 years for a foreign airline. I won’t be taking anything for granted and no doubt there is a lot to learn in the US industry. I am very much looking forward to learning but would like to know from other E3 pilots if PSA provided any assistance in relocation costs. Eg, do they provide a ticket say on AA from Australia to Dayton to begin class? I’m thinking of just coming with the maximum 32kg of luggage and just buy whatever I need there. The upheaval of moving from one country to another is rather frightening though! Can’t wait to start. My class is mid July.

Does the company send you information on flows before training starts? I was curious if anyone else got that in an email. I didn’t see it anywhere. My guess is they don’t, but I thought I saw that mentioned somewhere on here.

Extra sim time is solely at the discretion of training management. It varies where extra training is needed, typically right before the MV or LOE.

People don’t “request” extra hours. Again, that’s at the discretion of training management based on what the instructor’s opinion is. They will give extra time, but they will also cap it off at a certain point.

The LOFT comes after the MV. If successfully completed, you get signed off to take your LOE (the ATP/Type is issued after the LOE). Somewhere in training you’ll do UPRT (upset prevention and recovery training). Sometimes it’s before the LOE, sometimes after. After all that, you go to IOE.

no. They do send out a study guide but it only covers limitations and 5 immediate action times. But that's all that's in the packet.

PSA organised my flight from Sydney to Dayton. All I had to pay was the tax which was about $90 Australian. You get 2 check in bags at 23 kg’s each. Then also 1 carry on and 1 small item (laptop bag).

You get 2 x 32kg bags check in for the international flight plus the connecting flights to Dayton. The problem is, you get 1 x 23kg bag on any domestic flight to Sydney if you don't live there. Qantas are charging $100 for that extra bag, Virgin are more reasonable in that you can buy extra kgs, dunno what REX are charging.

Thanks to the previous two posters. I am in sydney so that works for me. Did they provide hotel accommodation upon your arrival in Dayton because obviously we cannot land the day before class. My plan would be to arrive one week before class so am wondering if they provide a room?

It depends on if you have to do atp- ctp or if you already have an ATP. If you already have an ATP they want you in the US two weeks before class. If you need to complete atp - ctp then it’s about 5 days before class starts I think. Either way you have to pay for your own hotel room until you start class. The money is taken out of your sign on bonus.