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PSA CRJ 200 Skids off Runway at CRW

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PSA CRJ 200 Skids off Runway at CRW

Old 01-20-2010, 10:04 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by USMCFLYR View Post
I don't know about the CRJ200. I can tell you that I would never have aborted (above a 100 kts) for an anti-skid failure in my aircraft - even on the 13,000' runway that I came from last. In my post I certainly did not advocate aborting for any reason, especially at a high speed, quite the contrary. I was saying that in my experience (and aircraft) there were actually very FEW reasons to conduct a high speed abort. It would most likely lead to damage of the aircraft (and depending on what you were carrying on the aircraft) a simple abort, leading to hot brakes, leading to a brake fire, leading to a burnt up FLIR could eventually end in a Class A mishap

I will be interested in learning more about this mishap in the future and I'll *speculate* that there will be lessons learned - good or bad.

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An abort for an anti-skid caution would be ludicrously counter-productive...you don't need it to go flying, but you sure might need to it to stop safely!


The two airlines I have worked at perform a high-speed (> 80kts) abort only for engine fire/failure/severe damage, reverser unlocked, fire indication, or loss of control.
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:06 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by USMCFLYR View Post
Stop with the mantra already. Speculation goes both ways. If you are going to pick on Airway's post, then question the ones already posting praise without having any idea WHY/OR HOW they aborted.

PinnacleFO has it right for now. Hold the criticism AND the praise until facts are known if you're the type of poster that hates speculation.

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Don't order me around, Marine. I'm not your subordinate. And I frankly couldn't care less what you think of my post.

Also not sure how you perceived my comment as picking on anyone.
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:07 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Twin Wasp View Post
Just wondering, I don't know the answer. One part of the V1 equation is it's the highest speed you can reach, lose an engine, reject and stay on the runway and any overrun that is stressed for aircraft and as wide as the runway. (My dispatcher side coming out.) My question is, do they count EMAS in the equation? If you're runway limited and reject, is it planned that you'll go into the EMAS? And if so, what value does EMAS give you? Is 100 feet of EMAS worth 500 feet of normal pavement or what?
EMAS is not counted. Per your definition, "overrun that is stressed for aircraft." The EMAS is NOT stresed for aircraft, that's how it works, by breaking apart due to being run over by 20K plus pounds of aircraft.
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:07 AM
  #34  
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I don't know about you guys, but I will abort for an EFIS COMP MON at any speed.
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:37 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by John Pennekamp View Post
Don't order me around, Marine. I'm not your subordinate. And I frankly couldn't care less what you think of my post.

Also not sure how you perceived my comment as picking on anyone.
I'm not ordering you around - and thanks for the compliment.
I'm pointing out that speculation goes both ways.

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Old 01-20-2010, 10:43 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by UNDPilot View Post
I don't know about you guys, but I will abort for an EFIS COMP MON at any speed.
If that's how you roll you must hardly ever fly!
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Old 01-20-2010, 02:42 PM
  #37  
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Looks like a textbook EMAS save. Lucky people...

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Old 01-20-2010, 03:20 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by SilverandSore View Post
Does PSA abort above 80KIAS for fire or engine failure only? (Birds would be another one to add to that list.) That is the policy at ASA but we've had our share of captains aborting above 80 for things other than that.... (yes, Anti Skid too!)
...or if in the opinion of the Captain, the ability of the aircraft to fly is imperiled.

It is not an absolute. There is no policy. The decision to continue or abort at any speed rests with the PIC. I am glad I was not in that position.

I am interested in looking at the speeds involved from the perspective of seeing if our performance numbers are valid. I have wondered about this at V1 in EYW on the CR2. Talk about short. At least there you dont have to worry about running off a cliff!
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Old 01-20-2010, 03:40 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by FlyJSH View Post
He had to make a split-second decision, and I'm glad he decided to stop. Everyone's safe -- that's all that matters.

Amen. That's why we get paid the big bucks.

Cudos to the crew, and cudos to the EMAS.
I'm glad things turned out OK - the bottom line is that no one was hurt and EMAS appears to have saved the day. BUT - those guys aren't getting paid "big bucks." They're grossly underpaid.

Another issue: the EMAS is only in the overruns... so it begs the question: why did they reject a takeoff and end up in the overrun? I know nothing about CRJ TOLD and I'm not throwing spears. I'm just curious how this will turn out.
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Old 01-20-2010, 04:28 PM
  #40  
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As said before, the real heroes are the people who decided that the runoff area needed this EMAS. Without it we would likely be talking about a far more serious incident.

The FAA and PSA will find out about what happened. In the meantime we all have to be thankful for the foresight somebody had to deal with a very unlikely eventuality which turned reality.
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