Spin-up Training for ATP-to-Regional-to-Major
 

First, thanks to all for the vast amount of information posted here. I've learned much.

I'm retired AF and haven't been in the seat for about 10 years. I'm spinning up to take the ATP-CTP and Written in about 2 months. Plan is then to apply to the Regionals, build a few hundred hours and then try to jump to the Majors. I am right about at the required 1,500 hours for my ATP Cert.

In prep for this transition, I'd like some input regarding flight training to knock off the rust beforehand. Options are Cessna platform w/ G1000, Diamond platform w/ G1000 or a Cirrus w/ their G1000 (which from what I understand is like a G1000 on steroids). I could also just try to find a basic Cessna or Piper platform and get some stick-n-rudder time. Any thoughts on which might be the better training platform and could help in the transition to the Regionals?

Additional item, what about a mix of Single-Engine and Multi-Engine sorties? There are a few Barons around. Is Multi-Engine flying prior to the Regionals helpful? Any other thoughts?

Thanks for your reply.

The ATP CTP course is a really spin up trainer for the airlines. They told me have fun because it's the one time where you can't fail anything while you're in a sim. As for renting airplanes, I wouldn't spend a lot of time and lose seniority over trying to fly a Cessna. Maybe a few hours if you wanna get some muscle memory back. Review IFR rules. Right now in the Regional world, the only way to wash out is to have a bad attitude and lack of eagerness to learn. The most difficult thing in training is the single engine ILS I'm not to sure if spending hundreds to thousands of dollars on a baron will help you out that much though.

My biggest recommendation is to go to a regional that has AQP training for initial because that is train to proficiency (you won't fail for being 20 feet off on steep turns).

I say spend too much time and money in before because of the ATP CTP program. It was like going to airline training before going to airline training. Get in, get your currency, get on to a major. Seniority is everything

MrBogardi -- Thanks for the info. Yes, from what I've heard the ATP-CTP is relatively low threat. Seems like an Airline CRM course with some SIMs thrown in. However, it's better not to look like a complete baffoon. Particularly since one might show back on their radar in a year asking for a job.


I'll research the Regionals and look into their particular training programs.


Thanks!

Why waste money paying for single-engine piston time? Maybe take a few hours, get an IPC, then go fly freight in BE-99s for Ameriflight or something along that line. Those ops require 1200 TT, 500 xc, 200 night, and 75 inst and you don't need the ATP rating. However, it will make you super sharp and proficient. Must more than putzing around at 90 knots in a "glass" cockpit C172. Also, you'll need a couple thousand hours of turbine time with at least 1000 PIC to be competitive at the majors. Many charter outfits are hiring SICs as well. I'm also retired AF enlisted, but fly for Skywest. The hiring is the best in decades. Get on it and best of luck!

MidnightHauler - Thanks for the words. How is Part 135 time looked at by the Majors vs Part 121 time with a Regional? Wouldn't that track you for a Cargo career (UPS/FedEX)? I meet the Quals for the Regionals and all my time is Multi-Turbine, about half is IP.

I don't really see why you would need any appreciable time in a cessna to prepare you for a regional. Flying a single piston is not indicative of the flying you will do at an airline.

Between the CTP and initial you'd probably end up at around 30 hours of time plus another 30 on IOE. 60 hours in the actual acft(or a close equivalent).

Maybe get an hour or 2 and do an IPC, anything further is a waste of money at best.

With your background (assuming fighters given your total time?), you just need recent professional turbine time of some sort. Any sort is fine. The more the better of course.

Possible fringe benefit of a regional would be showing that you can cheerfully sling gear for a civilian despite having been a senior officer in a past life.

UPS/FDX would prefer international heavy time or fighter time, if they prefer anything. FDX is more into fighter guys.

Fighter and Trainer make up the time. Recency is my issue. Any benefit to learning the G1000? My F-15 and T-37 were mostly steam gauges.

I'd say probably not. Most of the acft you will fly 121 have less advanced avionics than a g1000. I suppose a scan in a g1000 is more similar to your typical PFD in a 121 acft than a steam scan would be.

Like I said, maybe do a couple hours. You'll get reps during CTP and training for whatever regional you decide on.

ACEssXfer - Copy all. Thanks for the advise! Although I might try getting a sortie in the Cirrus just to try it out. Kinda like window shopping at the Ferrari dealer. Can't afford one but a test drive would be fun!

Good question. Part 135 turbine time is never a waste and still helps the "fast track" process to the majors. It's also good experience if you ever decide to go corporate or charter in case the airline gigs don't work out too well. The main thing everybody looks at now besides turbine time is crew experience. Flying single pilot freight in turboprops is great for building time for a couple of years, but you'll need the crew time soon. Regionals are probably the best place to be right now if you want to get to the majors and many are dropping the turbine PIC requirement. However, if you want to rack up a thousand or so PIC hours to check off that box on your apps, flying single pilot freight for a year or two will be the fastest. No waiting around to upgrade.

I was an F-15 crew chief. Love that airplane!

Honestly, with your background most likely all you're going to need is to be instrument current (either IPC or have required # of approaches in the past 6 months) for one of the more selective regionals. There will be some that might hire you with the 10 year gap and roll the dice and bank on your background for your ability to complete training.

If you want to go to a 121 major my recommendation would be to to a 121 regional and apply to the majors as soon as you have 100-200 hours at the regional under your belt (100-200 hours in the last 12 months is the benchmark for currency/recency for folks).

I personally recommend folks look at AAs wholly owned regionals so they have a flow creating movement in their seniority list when AA is holding classes, But pick a regional that works for your career goals and where you want to live.

While FDX likes the international heavy time (C17/KC10/Atlas) they are putting increasing preference on the regional pilots. I spoke with the System Chief Pilot back in January and he said as much as they are easy to train. The point system used has been changed to increase the score for RJ captains and especially check airman. Right now it seems to be a 50/50 split military/civilian.

I took a break from flying before I came to a regional. I thought about it like you... "I need to go fly an airplane"! The truth was, other than being able to check the recency of experience box on an application, flying around in a 172 didn't do anything for me. I found that my time/money was better spent in an FTD or RedBird type simulator shooting approaches. So here is what I would do if I were you:

1) Find a facility that has an FTD (flight training device) and get some hours in that shooting RNAV and ILS approaches.

2) Fly a 172 or whatever you want only to get current in an airplane. Not to get ready for your ATP.

He will neither need nor want to wait six years for flow. Pick the regional with the best domicile locations for your personal situation.

The other downside with going to a Regional tagged with a Major is, although they "guarantee" you an interview with that Major, it's not typically until 1000hrs as a Capt. That, in my mind, locks you in with that Regional for at least 2+ years.

There are also some who will pay for your ATP training, but again they have a payback timeframe (typically 2 years). I was done with ADSCs (Active Duty Service Commitments) when I retired from the AF. Hurts a little more to cover the costs upfront but should give me more options down the road.

Thanks for all the input!

Sheppard Air!
Sheppard Air Flight Test 5.0 Prep Software ATP, Flight Engineer, Mil Comp - FAA Airline Transport Pilot

Out of the cockpit 10 years and less than 1500 hours? It may not take 6 years but he still should go somewhere where he can upgrade quickly and strengthen his resume.

He's a fighter pilot, he'll be fine by 2,000 TT...especially as hiring ramps up over the next couple years.

That's the same advice I got from several other sources. Thanks to all for the help. Lots of good info.

I did take the advice to start getting some SIMs and brush up on ILS and GPS approaches. Yesterday, during my first SIM in 10+ years, only a handful of the passengers in the back got sick from my flying. It's a start!

To get to the 2000hr mark more quickly, definitely shy away from regionals where you're going to be spending a couple years on reserve (flying 300hrs/year ) and go to one where you can hold a line right away and upgrade as soon as you hit 1000 121 SIC time.

Fear not, most of these planes have a working autopilot ;)