How do people wash out of airline training?
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2018
Posts: 117
We had a CFII and a 135 carrier pilot wash out. We had CFIs and helicopter pilots get through just fine. Don't put yourself under an umbrella that groups a ton of different people that shouldn't be compared. I know plenty of great CFIs who don't have the other I, and would do great at indoc. I also know MEIs who I doubt would make it through due to their work ethic. Depending on where you go, as long as you aren't afraid to seek extra help when you don't understand something, they'll help you out. Just study, study, study. Know your flows, limitations, and memory items. The rest will come...but if you show you can't put forth the effort to memorize the easy things, it'll be a long road.
#12
The pilots I’ve seen really struggle where an absolute mess of nerves to the point they couldn’t even see straight. When it comes time to strap on the sim you need to put all that away, the check airman/fed are just another passenger and your going to take them to the destination safely. Build you confidence. By this point your the best sim pilot (in your mind anyway) in the company and can nail the V1 profile with one hand while stirring cream into your coffe with the other (not really). The best way to build your confidence is to know that you know the material because you’ve studied it and practiced it to satisfaction. Go in with a deep breath knowing I’ve done my part and will do the best that I can do.
#13
The pilots I’ve seen really struggle where an absolute mess of nerves to the point they couldn’t even see straight. When it comes time to strap on the sim you need to put all that away, the check airman/fed are just another passenger and your going to take them to the destination safely. Build you confidence. By this point your the best sim pilot (in your mind anyway) in the company and can nail the V1 profile with one hand while stirring cream into your coffe with the other (not really). The best way to build your confidence is to know that you know the material because you’ve studied it and practiced it to satisfaction. Go in with a deep breath knowing I’ve done my part and will do the best that I can do.
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2014
Position: B787 FO
Posts: 294
Keep in mind Airline training is not designed to teach you basics you should know before showing up....there simply isn’t time to go over basic airmanship and IFR procedures. It’s designed to teach you how to operate your assigned aircraft. Have your fundamentals down like holding and approach procedures, Approach charts, etc......every minute spent properly flying a twin engine ILS , missed approach procedure, or hold is time not spent doing a V1 cut or single engine GPS approach in the sim.
#15
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2018
Posts: 28
All the comments about attitude are are correct. I saw a guy with previous military helicopter and airline experience wash out because of his work ethic and attitude. But, it’s not just about attitude. You can get through Indoc, Systems and Procedures Training by paying attention and studying hard. The sims is where the rubber hits the road. I saw 4 people out of 30 fail in the sims.
Almost everything you do in the sims is an instrument procedure. This is why the CFII is useful. For example, can you translate ATC instructions into intercepting radials? “Intercept and track inbound on the CVG 074 radial”.
Get as much glass cockpit time as you can. Everything in the cockpit is glass and you want to be able to interpret it easily.
Try to get some experience in the National Airspace System. If you have any friends who fly King Airs, or Citations and you can tag along on a trip with them, just observing. Three or four days of seeing how everything works, STARs, DPs, how it all works together.
Check out the articles at Jeppesen Chart Clinic Jeppesen Chart Clinic Articles (from AOPA Pilot magazine). The airlines use Jepp plates, not NOAA. This is good for the interview too.
Read The Turbine Pilots Manual by Brown and Holt. All good stuff. It makes going into systems easy, because you understand the concepts.
Study for your ATP written with something like Shepard Air. Sure, the airline will probably give you a free copy, but you want to know that stuff going in. If money is an issue, buy the Gleim book and work your way through that.
Hope it helps!
Almost everything you do in the sims is an instrument procedure. This is why the CFII is useful. For example, can you translate ATC instructions into intercepting radials? “Intercept and track inbound on the CVG 074 radial”.
Get as much glass cockpit time as you can. Everything in the cockpit is glass and you want to be able to interpret it easily.
Try to get some experience in the National Airspace System. If you have any friends who fly King Airs, or Citations and you can tag along on a trip with them, just observing. Three or four days of seeing how everything works, STARs, DPs, how it all works together.
Check out the articles at Jeppesen Chart Clinic Jeppesen Chart Clinic Articles (from AOPA Pilot magazine). The airlines use Jepp plates, not NOAA. This is good for the interview too.
Read The Turbine Pilots Manual by Brown and Holt. All good stuff. It makes going into systems easy, because you understand the concepts.
Study for your ATP written with something like Shepard Air. Sure, the airline will probably give you a free copy, but you want to know that stuff going in. If money is an issue, buy the Gleim book and work your way through that.
Hope it helps!
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2016
Position: A350 CA
Posts: 295
Airline training is very easy if you are a decent pilot with a good attitude. I was 20 years old with 250 hours when I did my first 121 Turbo Prop initial training for a midwest based regional airline. Those were much harder than jets and back in those days, you had to study a lot more than today. Either you know how to fly or you dont. Thats what matters most in training. Know limitations and memory items. Understand the systems, dont need to know everything. A good understanding is adequate. Pay attention in class and ask questions when you need clarification. Instructors are there to help you. If you really want to be ready for a regional, I would recommend flight instructing at the FlightSafety Academy down in Vero Beach, FL. Their instructors get the best experience and all my peers from those days are Captains at Major Airlines today.
#17
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2018
Posts: 34
Yeah, GA IFR doesn’t really compute to Part 121...so just eat the elephant one bite at a time. Depends on the jet though. 145 is closest thing to your standard GA plane. I’ve seen a lot of folks wash out of 175 initial, but mostly old timers that can’t run the computer.
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Posts: 658
You bring the drive, motivation, attitude, and basic skills. They’ll build the airline pilot out of you. Biggest thing I’ve seen get people is the attitude “well there’s a pilot shortage, they’re hiring everyone they can. They need me.” If you become difficult to work with, not teachable, or cost them money, they’ll let you go.
On the other had I’ve seen people struggle to grasp a few things but show that they’re willing to put in the effort. The company and the instructors are willing to go well out of their way to try and help them succeed.
On the other had I’ve seen people struggle to grasp a few things but show that they’re willing to put in the effort. The company and the instructors are willing to go well out of their way to try and help them succeed.
#19
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post