Ret Mil - FO Interview PSA, ExpressJet, Envoy
 

Hey all, first post and trying to get some good advice before going on my interviews. I’m prepped for the interviews but looking for any advice on which of the 3 regionals would be best. And unfortunately I can’t go straight to Majors. I suspect with prior experience, I’ll only be with regional for 6-8 months then transition to Major. Right now I’ll have to commute from Fort Walton Beach. Thoughts? Anything is appreciated! Thank you!

Expressjet or PSA, both have increased pay recently. Pay/QOL (especially reserve rules) is in the dumps at Envoy right now.

Given your plan, and assuming you’re correct time wise. Take the one that will get you on the line the earliest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

^^^THIS^^^


If you're looking to build currency and hours, you can stand on your head in a bucket of $#!+ for that expected amount of time.

Don't ever move. That's one of the best beaches in the country.

Between hurricanes...

Got it. Thanks. Pay between all three are within 2-3 dollars so I’m not too concerned with that. And the bonuses are pointless to me also because I’ll save it to payback the regional after leaving early because of ATP/CTP contract. (fingers crossed).

I might be looking at this the wrong way, but because I’m going to be commuting, I was thinking keep the commute as short as possible and go with nonstops if able. Out of KVPS, PSA is only nonstop to CLT or DCA, but I’m not sure if I could get either of those anyway as a jr FO.

All ExpressJet bases suck for KVPS and KPNS. All layover and about 5-7 hours.

I don’t want to get stuck on reserves forever but Envoy has DFW and MIA which I can get nonstop flights for out of KVPS or KPNS. But again, I’m not sure ajr FO has a chance at those. Or if MIA is a money pit in hotel/pad costs! Envoy offers 4 company paid hotels per month so if that means whole reserve time paid for in MIA then maybe?

I’m starting to wonder if it’s gonna suck for 6-8 months no matter where I go until I can get to major. Hoping for cargo ultimately.

You aren't going to get MIA at Envoy (it's small and senior), and probably not DFW. Most likely ORD/LGA. You'll be on reserve for up to a year. You won't even hold reserve at MIA for 10+ months, maybe more than a year.

The pay rates might be close, but the amount you credit won't be. You'll sit on reserve at envoy (worst rules in the industry right now) disallowing you from picking up open time, unless you spend the entire month living in base (not living in Florida).

Any regional with a base in ATL, so you have the ability to drive to and from work in a pinch.

What did you fly in the Mil? Asking simply to verify your timeline. If you are a rotor guy, you can kiss the 6-8 month timeline goodbye, not to mention at most regionals it will take you at least that long to get through hiring, training, IOE and then onto the line. If it's been a decade since you last flew, I would also say that is going to slow your progress to a major.

C-17s from 2009-2012; left as an IP. T-6B IP from 2012-2015. Staff job from 2015-2018. From what I heard, 6-8 months is close but I have no idea. All this is new to me.

Why not use gi bill and go to get your atp-ctp. Pop to flight safety in ATL....

Pay is a small snapshot of reality. As someone else mentioned the amount you’ll credit is significantly better at expressjet.

Read some of the PSA threads and go back a few pages and it’s discussed in greater detail.

Expressjet FOs are making more than all 3 of the American wholly owned’s captains. If you’re only going to be there 6-8 months maybe it’s not a big deal, but longer than that and the money will be more of a factor. I don’t know about the other places but reserve at PSA is about a year currently and increasing.

Appreciate your service, and I hope this works out. I’d also suggest not putting all your eggs in one basket either. You never know, they might not pick you up in the timeline you’re expecting and you have to grind through it with everyone else. Pick a place you can see yourself at for a extended period of time Incase it doesn’t work out or god forbid the industry takes a turn.

6-8 months is pretty ambitious depending on the number of hours/ quals that you have from your previous flying life. Most majors look for 100-200hrs for currency/recency in the last 12 months. If training takes 3-4 months, that’s a lot of flying especially if you’ll be on reserve. 12-18 months may be more reasonable.

Ok well that's good, at least in terms of moving on quicker. As for your timeline, I agree that it is ambitious at best. Do yourself a favor and plan on two years, hopefully you can get out in 1.5.

When you plan in things like the hiring cycle, class dates, training, sims, IOE etc, plus then getting onto reserve and sitting, time adds up quickly.

I wish you the best of luck and believe me, it will be worth it in the long wrong, but I wouldn't bet on 6-8 months if it was my money.

^What he said. First year pay at ExpressJet equates to around $50 per hour when you consider the “Earned Quarterly Override” payments. That’s regular compensation and not a bonus, so you won’t have to worry about paying those back if you leave.

In addition, there’s a $22,000 new hire bonus that has a 24 month commitment. As you mentioned, this isn’t really a factor in your decision.

What would be more important to you is that ExpressJet has available seats in class now, and will probably get you through training the quickest at about 3 months. Reserve rules are pretty good when compared to other regionals. (Airport standby is only 4 hours, you can’t be assigned airport standby 2 days in a row, you can’t be assigned airport standby on the last day of your reserve block.) Reserve should only be 3 or 4 months, and junior FO’s can expect to build a lot of hours over the next year.

I'd go where they get you in class and out flying the fastest, and where the commute is doable.

Envoy is a touch over 2 months from day 1 of indoc to start of IOE, and no wait for classes as of now. You'll get DFW quickly, either as a 175 new hire if you get lucky, or base transfer if you get 145 ORD. MIA is just under a year to hold but if you get 175, it's not an option.

Another point that I think is important - make sure the regional you go to has AQP, and a good training program (Envoy does). If you wash out/fail, you can kiss that 6-8 month timeline goodbye. There are regionals that are known for new hire abuse. Avoid these at all costs.

Why not pursue a ULCC/NK/F9/G4 instead of regionals, unless a hiring bonus is your game here? Sounds like you are in the southeast, so Air Wisconsin might be a fit, $37k bonus at end of OE and CAE base. If not, then Republic has a hiring bonus of similar amount, but a hefty backlog.
Better everything, might involve going to an event and associated costs with that (all attending PSP next week 7 Feb+), so you could scamble our to that, or if nogo then WIA or the next national job fair (airline pilot solutions or whatnot).

Unnecessary, he can take written for Commercial ME instrument and get license at local FSDO with FEF, then take ATP written and find a local school with an APD and get his ATP done. That’s what I did.

FAPA.aero | Pilot Job Fairs

List of attendees for FLL event this month.

Again, I’d avoid the regionals if I were you. As a military type, it isn’t worth the stink associated with (feel free to practice bleeding, though, if that’s your gig.....).

https://www.ngpa.org/ngpa_industry_expo

Very well attended by airlines hiring. Not sure if tix are still available.

PM if F9 is of interest. I’m retired USAF as well.

Good luck.

:rolleyes:





:rolleyes:






:rolleyes:

Basically, I’m hurting for currency due to my last non-flying assignment before retirement. My last flight was Jun 2015. Last assignment was in Japan and I was unable to get my ATP practical done because of that assignment. So I need that. If I’m gonna have to be with a regional for up to a year, then I don’t care about the commitment. Right now I have Commercial MEI, SEI, Mil comp CFI, CFII. I have over 2,400 hours all turbine time. So I’m hoping that I can do my regional time, fly hard and get to FedEx ASAP.

175s our of DFW would be awesome for me. Easy commute. I’ve heard that ExpressJet will be doing 175s in Houston soon and for backfill might have to start new hires there. Easy commute if I can get that within a few months if not out of training.

By the way, thank you all for the info! I really appreciate it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So basically I’m hurting for currency. My last Air Force assignment was non-flying in Japan. Last flight was Jun 2015. I did the ATP written on the last day before the rules changed and because of the Japan assignment I wasn’t able to get my practical done. My quals are Commercial MEI, SEI, Mil comp CFI, CFII with over 2,400 turbine hours and somewhere around 1,000 something PIC. I can feel the rust in my brain since I’ve started diving back into the instrument/rules stuff. Sounds like ExpressJet is the favored in the group so far. I will say they’ve seemed the nicest by far on the phone. They told me (yeah I know what recruiters are capable of) that there will be 175s at Houston soon and that I could probably get Houston after a few months if not possibly out of training due to backfill needs but who knows. Maybe it’s smoke and mirrors.. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

???

There are regionals better than F9, where you don't have to try to teach yourself the freaking bus.

If you're in a hurry to get trained, get time, and move on regionals are probably the best bet. That's a proven formula, in seen it play out many times with guys in my reserve units. F9 might make sense in certain niche circumstances... that involve an ex wife and kids in DEN.

Guessing you did this before the rules changed. Everybody has to take the ATP-CTP course now before the ATP written, including mil pilots.

It sounds like most people are saying go toward ExpressJet bases on the three I am interviewing with. ExpressJet is about to get 175s at Houston, which would be a great commute for me if I can eventually get it. The recruiter said I should be able to within 6 months and even maybe possibly get it out of training based on the back fill needed for the new jets. Who knows though whatbreceuiters will say. I did an ATP written on the last day before the rules changed and I couldn’t get the practical done before I had to take my Japan’s assignment in the Air Force. Right now I don’t have the ATP, but I do have Commercial, MEI, SEI, CFI, CFII, and over 2,400 turbine hours.

Well, no matter where you go, they have to complete your RATP/ATP prior to OE/CSK, so that is good.

We have a couple of 1,100 RATPs in new hire right now, so again, not telling you what to do, I’d do that at a place where you’d get more out of it than just getting your ticket squared away, like NK/F9/G4 and some access to CA on a larger bird in 3 years.

Just saying.

Can you even apply at F9/NK/G4 without an ATP?

Frontier won't take your app without ATP for example.

I’m not in the job market, so I don’t know, but I’ll find out.

If the regionals are hiring pilots without or RATPs, I’d be surprised if the ones I named aren’t. Just a reality for all airlines as the collective experience and size of the potential hiring pool contracts.

Kind of like how NK used to tout the highest required PIC, and WN used to require the 737 type, but those both were dropped since 2014.

F9/NK went from bottom feeders to career destinations when they got their new contracts.

Career destinations? Whatever that means.

I disagree. I can only speak for F9, but it has always been a pretty tight pilot group that could cherry pick applicants as it was growing/hiring when legacies were furloughing and no one else in the US was hiring. Growth since 2013 in bases (2 then vs 5 now, and more to come) has certainly fueled opportunity, and relatively short upgrades on the Airbus (good living) plus the new CBA & pay rates definitely will make for interest from a growing group of pilots.

NK sure.

F9 is small, with uncertainty as to what management ultimately intends in the long run. Probably a better place to be in the future than the past, but a young guy probably won't retire from F9. I'd consider them if you absolutely have to be in one of their bases (DEN anyway, not sure how stable the other bases are) and aren't competitive for other airlines. And the F9 contract still lags the middle and top tier majors.

If you are coming off a staff job and non-current/non-recent, you can expect to realistically spend 12-18 months at the regionals.

Might it be less? Yep. More? Certainly, yes.

I know of non-current mil guys called up for major interviews right after updating their apps with their fresh, new type rating and were at the regionals only barely long enough to complete IOE. I also know guys who spent 2 years at the regionals waiting for the call and upgraded to Captain. All of them were guys with good resumes and no major skeletons in their closets.

Be emotionally and financially prepared for 2 years, and be happy when it doesn't actually take that long.

Thanks all. I’m not sure what the standard is as far as interviews go with the regionals. So far I’m not impressed with Envoy at all. They took 2 days to get back to me just to schedule an interview and even then they did it by email after I called them. ExpressJet immediately called me to setup my interview, flights and hotel automatically. PSA took days to get back to me as well and I had to arrange my own hotel. No problem doing all that but ExpressJet sure does accommodate people.

Sorry I’m new to the civilian flying world. What is OE/CSK?

IOE/OE initial operating experience, kind of like mission seasoning. Usually your first 25 hours+- flown with a LCA/line check airman/SEFE

CSK consolidation of skills & knowledge, a defined timetable (usually 90d after your initial PC/proficiency checkride) that you have to log 100 hours or you get to reset with another sim check. You normally track this and notify training if you are not on track.

I think in your situation you want the best quality training and by far XJT has the best out of those choices. Just my 2 cents.

Just for some comparison. We have a guy who came in flying the C-130, still does air guard stuff flying them on orders. He’s been with us now 15 months. 6-8 months may have worked for some, but won’t for all. Make sure you go somewhere you’re willing to be for awhile.