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Old 02-12-2019, 07:53 PM   #11  
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It's a 750/1000/1250/1500 rule. Not one size fits all.

I think it's great.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:56 PM   #12  
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The only people who are against the 1500 hour rule are the regional airlines and the people without 1500hrs.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:57 PM   #13  
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Originally Posted by captande View Post
I did a case report on that specific accident in college. It was crazy to look back and see the comments on threads chastising the FO for retracting the flaps when they had the tail stall. Today, that’s the proper recovery taught for that situation.

Regulatory wise I think the 117 rules are the best thing that came from it. “1500” hours though? My 1500 hours is different from yours. You could’ve been ready for the airlines at 500, whereas someone else won’t be ready until 2500. You can’t put a number on experiences in my opinion.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

What were you guys smoking during this report case study deal? It was the wrong thing to do, they were in a full blown stall with the wings rocking back and forth.. spin from trying to aileron roll out instead of pushing the yoke forward... go watch the NTSB animation and you’d think differently about the actions of the crash being the right thing to do. RIP to all the souls.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:59 PM   #14  
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What grade did you get? They didn’t have a tailplane stall.

Dera, PRIA was around well before this.

1500 has been neutered by big money lobbyists. So the inspector was right.
Today the inexperience in the right seat is glaring. Most want to learn. Some really worry me.
Yeah, PRIA is from 1996 I believe, but it seems like airlines take PRIA much more seriously nowadays.
The Captain of Colgan 3407 "forgot" to mention a few failed checkrides and checking events, something that you couldn't really do today (unless you go to Mesa).
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:00 PM   #15  
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😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

What were you guys smoking during this report case study deal? It was the wrong thing to do, they were in a full blown stall with the wings rocking back and forth.. spin from trying to aileron roll out instead of pushing the yoke forward... go watch the NTSB animation and you’d think differently about the actions of the crash being the right thing to do. RIP to all the souls.
The crazy thing was that they weren't even close to stall when the event started. They had 20+ knot margin to an actual stall. The captain pulled it to a stall for reasons we will never know.
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:07 PM   #16  
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Originally Posted by captande View Post
I did a case report on that specific accident in college. It was crazy to look back and see the comments on threads chastising the FO for retracting the flaps when they had the tail stall. Today, that’s the proper recovery taught for that situation.

Regulatory wise I think the 117 rules are the best thing that came from it. “1500” hours though? My 1500 hours is different from yours. You could’ve been ready for the airlines at 500, whereas someone else won’t be ready until 2500. You can’t put a number on experiences in my opinion.
It was a normal stall. Airspeed went unnoticed as it was deteriorating. They were in heavy icing conditions so it appeared that the pilots mistook it for a tail stall and applied that recovery. Was this a result of the fatigue? I would say so. It’s kind of hard to Monday night quarterback their actions, when thankfully we are protected from experiencing their QOL at that time.

I agree with you on the fact you can’t put a number on experience level. How you got to that number obviously separates us. Also the quality of the experience is as well. Would you say someone with 1500 clean hours (no emergencies or ride failures) has more experience than the guy with 250 TT who has dealt with multiple emergencies and a checkride failure (learned from their own mistake)?

I still don’t understand where “1500” hours came from. Both pilots had well over that amount in TT.
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:09 PM   #17  
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The crazy thing was that they weren't even close to stall when the event started. They had 20+ knot margin to an actual stall. The captain pulled it to a stall for reasons we will never know.
They were very close to a stall when the event started. The shaker went off before the captain pulled up.
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:13 PM   #18  
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It's a 750/1000/1250/1500 rule. Not one size fits all.

I think it's great.
Correct me if I’m wrong because I’m too lazy to research, but I believe the R-ATP mins came after the initial legislation due to the sudden lack of qualified pilots.
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:14 PM   #19  
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So what do you think... Did this really fix the problems of the regional industry?
It wasn't supposed to fix most of the problems. Most of the "problems" are simply people allowing themselves to be taken advantage of.

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Are the skies really that much safer now?
As measured in fatalities per X number of RPM's in the US, yes. Is all or most of that due to the 1500 rule? Hard to know.

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Do regionals still continue to get away with poor pilot treatment, regardless of union representation?
The 1500 rule helped with that too. After 1500 hours in GA/CFI, people are slightly less willing to put up with crap than they would have been at 300 hours, when the shiny jet out-shined all other considerations.

But there's a difference between treating your employees like crap and safety. The two can be related, but fundamentally nobody, FAA, NTSB, or Congress cares if your job sucks. You can always quit, and there will almost always be someone willing to fill your shoes (and for less money).
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:17 PM   #20  
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Correct me if I’m wrong because I’m too lazy to research, but I believe the R-ATP mins came after the initial legislation due to the sudden lack of qualified pilots.
IIRC it was in the original law when signed, but was added in during the legislative and rulemaking process. Which is how it's supposed to work.
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