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Question about pay
Ok, so I fly Part 135 for a living, but have been lurking here in the 121 area keeping an eye on a potential career move (always looking for better pay & QOL). I've seen quite a few posts indicating that flying for a regional can be lucrative if you can get past the first few years as an fo, but after looking through the pay scale tables, I don't see how that works out ... unless you fly quite a few more hours than the guarantee.
So, for those of you who are living the 121 dream, what's the pay and how many hours are you flying to get it? As an FYI, for those of you who have never flown Part 135, I get paid by the day. Most of my trips are out and back the same day, but if I have to stay over night, I get paid extra. My expenses are covered as well. Other 135 operators may pay differently (e.g. by the mile). The pay is good, but as I fly corporate charter (on-demand), I never know what trips I may have from day to day. Some weeks I may fly 2 days and other weeks I might have 6 days worth of trips. |
I'm making 25000 my first year as an fo, and hopefully will make about 60000 as a captain w/third year pay (if I am able to upgrade by then).
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You're perceptive...looking at a regionals hourly payscale alone is a sure way to get a dangerous misunderstanding or reality. For example the mesa payscale is pretty decent for senior captains...on paper anyway.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied... Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours). A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin'). Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200 In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year. Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more). That all adds up to about $79K. |
Originally Posted by AV8ER
(Post 175241)
I'm making 25000 my first year as an fo, and hopefully will make about 60000 as a captain w/third year pay (if I am able to upgrade by then).
If it's the latter, and you're an fo for 3 years or more before making ca, you would then have another 3 years to go as ca ... with a grand total of 6 years or more invested to get to 60k? |
Most airlines have the longevity from date of hire. You don't start over at the bottom of the CA payscale when you upgrade. Virgin America would be the most recent exception to that rule.
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
(Post 175242)
You're perceptive...looking at a regionals hourly payscale alone is a sure way to get a dangerous misunderstanding or reality. For example the mesa payscale is pretty decent for senior captains...on paper anyway.
It is critical to understand the workrules which determine when and how that payscale gets applied... Guarantee usually only applies if you are on reserve and don't get called, or fly less than the monthly guarantee (usually 70-75 hours). A typical lineholder at a reasonable airline might work 14-15 days, block 80-90 hours but due to workrules he is likely to credit (get paid) 85-100+ hours. If you're all about money, you can normally pick up extra flying at x1.5 pay (or even x2.0 if they're hurtin'). Let's look at a junior RJ CA who credits 90 hours/month @ $65/hour: 90 hours/month x 12 = 1080 x$65/hr = $70,200 In addition you get per diem ($1.60/hr) for every hour you spend on a trip, so that adds up also. Some folks (not me) pack lunch-meat sandwichs and save their per diem too. This can hit $5K/year. Some airlines (including mine) pay performance bonuses, which can be a significant percentage of your income. Let's say 5% (might be more). That all adds up to about $79K. |
Eagle's upgrade time is not indicative of most of the industry right now. That could all change for better or for worse in a heartbeat.
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Originally Posted by cbire880
(Post 175255)
Eagle's upgrade time is not indicative of most of the industry right now. That could all change for better or for worse in a heartbeat.
Not complaining, just trying to put a career path together. :D |
Originally Posted by FlyingCheap
(Post 175248)
Is that making 60k after 3 years total with the airline (assuming you make ca in the first 3 years) or is it making 60k 3 years after making ca?
If it's the latter, and you're an fo for 3 years or more before making ca, you would then have another 3 years to go as ca ... with a grand total of 6 years or more invested to get to 60k? No, it doesn't work that way. If you are an FO for an airline for 3 years, you are on 4 year FO pay. If you then upgrade to captain in the same year, you are now on 4 year CA pay. So, you are a 3 year CA once you start your 3rd year of service with the company, i.e. after completing two years of service. Confusing? |
Originally Posted by FlyingCheap
(Post 175251)
If it takes as long to upgrade as most have pointed out here, wouldn't you be in the double digits of employment years with AE before you are a 4 or 5 year captain?
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