Well, for starters don't jump on the PFT bandwagon, or go to work for a company like Mesa. Pay your dues and come up through the ranks to earn your keep. The easy way isn't always the best way especially when you consider how much money it costs you and how much less you may make because of the stigma and labels you may recieve. Remember, even prostitutes get paid to work.

I don't think it's so much a matter of stopping the flow of newcomers, I think it's a matter of getting the starrey-eyed look out of their faces regarding jets.

Once again I'll ask this question, what is so bad about Mesa?

I think I answered this before, but...nothing, as long as you don't mind sub-standard pay, poor working conditions and a management group that knows no matter how bad they make life, pilots will continue to fly for them. Come on, $19/hr to fly a Dash 8? I make more than that flying a Piper Warrior! If I wanted to teach initial CFIs, I would STILL be making more than a 2 yr turboprop FO at Mesa AND be flying a Warrior! If that's not messed up, I dont know what is.

this might **** some of the regional guys off in here but i think one of the many problems is scope. These scopes in contracts are allowing regionals to fly 80-90 seats now. Yes thats all good for the regionals but look where it has gotten us, people are making careers here instead of making them stepping stones.

With smaller scopes these pilots would be moving up to fly these 70-100 seat airplanes at the majors. Which in turn provides better pay and chances to move up the to larger aircraft. I know at american airlines contract provides for a progression that would be something like this

FO -70-100 seats(EMB170,190)
FO - Md80 or 737
FO - 757,767
FO - 747
FO - 777

CA -70-100
"
"
"
"
CA - 777

These guys at the majors aren't trying to hold us down with scope they are trying to protect the top pay; where we all want to be some day.

Pilotpip mentioned the pay for training issue, and so we are clear that is not me. I don't want to set KillBill off because I did not spend half of my life sitting sideways but its taken me 4 years to get looked at by the regional airlines so, I am getting in when I can.

I know 4 years is not that long but when guys are doing it in 14 months its long enough. I truly appreciate everyone who has taken the long road or has gotten into this industry at a time when it was not realistic to have an airline look your way with less than 3000 hours but that is not the climate in today’s airline world.

Someone mentioned Mesa paying $19 an hour for a turboprop job, the only company I can find paying more is Piedmont. I too have made as much money flight instructing but I just don't see how another hour in a PA-28 is getting me any closer to that Dreamliner someday. You've got to get in the game and if someone is offering you 1000 hours a year for $19 an hour in a turbo prop, again what am I to do, sit back and let someone else take the seat.

There were 28 men and women at the interview I was invited too, some did not get a call. Should I to assume that I will single handedly change the situation by passing on the position for another year of "paying dues". News flash, I expect, and accept to always be paying my dues in this business and the old timers will most likely back that up.

Bottom line, some of the best advice I have heard and read from here is that in one form or another they (airlines) all suck. Yeah the new guy says its great but the 4 or 5 year guy is working on being a bit bitter and wait until they ask for some money back. It's business, it evolves. Someone mentioned it cycles and it does, but just like gas prices won't go back to $1.10 a gallon, regional pilot jobs probably are not going to pay first year FO's 30 bucks an hour anytime soon either.

If anyone actually has input on my initial question' What is happening with US Air and Mesa I would appreciate it. Thanks for the stimulating conversation.

There always seems to be someone whining about my rambling or poor grammar, sorry!

I am sorry, MY BAD. The real question was addressed, it got lost in the scuffle. Anyone have any inside information on anything Fosters brought up?

The problem is, there is no stepping stone right now and there won't be for quite some time. The national unions don't recognize that people are making careers out of the regionals and as a result, we are getting paid "B" scale wages. At one time the UAW negotiated all contracts based on one pay scale for all companies. Wouldn't it make sense for us to do the same?

Last I checked AA didn't bring the 747 out of retirement.

I would agree with the premise, to a certain extent, that flying being "outsourced" to regional/commuter carriers too often is bad for overall career progression and compensation for everyone. However, I ask you: how do you think it got to that point?

When I was at Eagle, I'd always run into an AA "super pilot" who would complain and moan about losing flying to us (and they have a valid point), but they (their union and its members) were the ones who allowed the flying to slip out of the control of scope. You can't blame the wannabe regional/commuter guy for the plight of the Major airline "super hero". They did it to themselves by allowing scope to degrade to what it is now, and it ain't a whole lot!

The fact is EVERYONE in the industry, including the Major guys, will do ANYTHING to either wear that shiny new uniform and walk through a terminal hoping to be noticed by travelers (in the case of the starry eyed newbies) or to keep what's left of their ever decreasing paycheck (in the case of the Major airline pilot). It's a pathetic industry right now, and I don't see it improving anytime soon if ever.

you got me on the 747's i wasnt thinking...:o

Lets not see this kind of shoddy reporting from you in the future. :D


So to further complicate my situation I now have gotten calls from 3 other companies to interview with. Still the bottom line is that I can, "at the moment" move up the pipe faster at Mesa.

Trust me I know the changes like underwear but all I can do is look "at the moment". Not only is it more pay in the left seat but its also the PIC time. No matter if it is a BE1900D or not it is PIC Time and it is getting guys on with bigger equipment carriers sooner than sitting right seat at a "better company" for the next 5 years. At age 35 I don't have that extra 15 years to give to climb the ladder.

Some guys will say to much to fast but most will agree that is how you need to be thinking.

To all of my Brothers in Flight, "Happy Holidays" which ever ones you and your families choose to celebrate!