Regional Advice
 

If you've got talent, treat the regionals like graduate school. Get in where you can upgrade quickly and graduate (Multi engine turbine pic) and then get out.

QOL, work rules and crew meals don't mean squat switch to your future major airline's hiring board.

Respectfully.

Lots of discussion on this very topic...I smell flame-bait! I'm staying out of it :D

A non-bait attempt
 

Assuming the airlines do the right thing and reduce/eliminate the terribly fuel and airspace inefficient RJs in the next 5 years:

If you've got talent, treat the regionals like graduate school. Get in where you can upgrade quickly and graduate (Multi engine turbine pic) and then get out.

RJ QOL, work rules and crew meals don't mean squat switch to your future major airline's hiring board.

Respectfully.

You're still talking about Jobs being lost, whether it opens the door for a few at mainline or not...there's no easy way to get rid of America's fleet of RJ's.

Agreed.

In a greener world, the Q400 would be the RJ killer. Send the RJs to China. Or maybe Bombardier could deal with Embraer to both drop the gas hogs and co-manufacture the Qs.

A 73 at 410 and .79 burns about 4300 pounds/hr with 137 pax.

The Ejets, ERJs and CRJs waste a lot of fuel per passenger mile.
(the worst, but they're all a close second, CRJ2 @370, .74 burning about 3000 pounds/hr with 50pax).

Anyway, I started this thread for those that debate which place to build time for their ultimate goal. Some airlines will hire candidates with 7 years of regional jet sic time, but at this time, the majority don't.

I agree up until the point that you're so burnt out flying for a crappy operation that you don't want to fly anymore. I hear a lot of guys echo the same thoughts when they decide to sacrifice a good contract for poor QOL and a quick upgrade. Next thing you know, they're lateraling to another regional. If you're at a great company with a short upgrade, the more power to you.

Sure, if you're young,unattached, and don't mind getting yanked around, go for the quick upgrade at a sketchy company. However, just like graduate school, GO TO ONE THAT FITS YOUR LIFESTYLE. Again, I don't want to sound like all quick upgrades are due to a bad operation, but some are.

Your advice is great for those like you, however I prefer my work rules and duty rigs over making it to a major a couple years earlier. I have the time and money to live the way I want for now, so it's a personal decision. Not everyone is dying to get to a major airline to fly until they drop dead.

Not trying to be confrontational. Your insight is valuable, but I'm just trying to shed some light on the other side of the coin!

You make a great point, some quick upgrades are due to a bad operation.

I remember listening to pilots in 2000 that wanted to wait until they could hold a line as a captain because they didn't want to get yanked around on reserve.

Those same pilots watched their pals that took the earlier upgrade, at their company, qualify and leave for "better" pastures, while they were stuck when the industry turned down.

Nothing is certain. Risk-taking rewards some, and smashes others in the face.

I personally agree 100% on this one. To each his/her own, but my bid is aligned to hold CA/RSV CA as soon as possible.

Also, just for discussion's sake, I'll comment on your contention that those who tried to avoid RSV CA in 2000 got screwed.... I know about ten Great Lakes guys who went for the quick and dirty upgrade in 2000 hoping to get on with a major quickly. Every one of them is at another regional. Same risk, just another facet of the equation.

I totally agree with getting left seat time, though. Just thought I'd add that some who went for it in 2000 got screwed too, as they could no longer stand the schedules at GLA.

How long is the initial training unitl you take your checkride at GLA?

If you've got talent, treat the regionals like graduate school. Get in where you can upgrade quickly and graduate (Multi engine turbine pic) and then get out.

ALL my friends in grad programs started out at 30k+ in their 1st year. Show me all the regionals that give you that kind of money.

QOL, work rules and crew meals don't mean squat switch to your future major airline's hiring board.

If you think that QOL and works rules don't mean anything just because it's a stepping stone, don't complain about pay or fatigue. Ever.

Like it or not, the Regionals are now a career-destination for many-a-Pilot...They've outgrown the dated "get in and get out" times. I say do your best to make it the best ride possible, 'cause you never know what's around the next corner.

AB...the sooner many wrap theirheads around what you said the sooner things will start to improve

...how about you go to a 4-year school, join AF ROTC, apply for OTS...and fly in the Military. Guaranteed gov't benefits/pension/steady paycheck from day one!!!

Bypass the regionals, and go fly for FedEx/UPS...and make all of us regional pilots jelous!

enough said...

Looked into that. Answer is because AF doesn't guarantee anything. Got a brother right now who wanted to be pushing the throttles by now but instead(5 years later) is still pushing a pen. He was promised 6 months before flight classes. 60 months later.......

Looked into that myself as well...Busted my tail and even got a coveted AFROTC Type 2 scholarship. Lucky me got it yanked thanks to budget cuts just before my school received their first check.

A lot of my friends, also hoping for their wings are now not getting any stick-time. It's not for everybody, and just like the Airlines, it's all about timing. Three years earlier and I would have had college paid for by the government, with the AF asking me to resign prior to commissioning, minus the penalties and paybacks, due to lack of officer slots for graduating seniors.

And there's always the ANG ;)

I hope so...it doesn't matter where you are or how quickly you plan on moving on - the only right thing to do is make sure you do anything in your power to make it a better place for those climbing the ladder below you.

The lack of a guarantee is one reason I never went the military route. Ive heard tha argument that they're not looking for pilots, they're looking for officers bla bla bla. They're probably loosing out on a lot of great pilots. I'm not very interested in the "officer" bit and all that goes with it, but I'd do it if they guaranteed me a flight spot. I know lots of people who feel the same way.

Senior -

Even if they did guarantee a flight slot - you still have to do the "officer bit" as you put it. You are probably still going to have soldiers/airmen/sailors or Marines working for you and you have to take care of your people. Also - except for *maybe* the Army WO program (and I don't know anything about it), there are a million other things to take up your time while you're trying to fly - most of them "officer" related in some way.

In short - if you didn't want to do the "officer bit" then you took the right road.

USMCFLYR

you know, i think if it wasn't for 9/11 there would be far fewer people who'd look to the regionals as a long term career type of location, as opposed to the simple stepping stone. Problem (as i see it) was that many individuals who would have made the jump ended up stagnated for an extra 6 + years, and when things at the majors finally started looking up again, these guys were senior, stable, and comfortable which in turn caused them to "stick around". Not saying it's a bad thing, nor a good thing, but the truth seems to be that we're all a bunch of dogs fighting each other over the scraps that get thrown off the table......And as long as we're in that situation, we'll have a hard time making things better, FOR ALL OF US.

I know 3X that many that went to the majors. If your buddies would've waited it out, they would be at a major right now. Like you said.. they hated the schedules. Nearly every person at Lakes that waited it out, got 1000+ PIC, checkairman, etc. has gone to a major (Alaska, Air Tran, Delta, FedEx, Frontier, Southwest, Northwest, to name a few). There are a few ex-lakers at FedEx laughing at the rj AND airforce guys because they got there in a lot less time. If QOL is that important then go for it, but turbine PIC will get you where you want to be the fastest... plain and simple.

Depends. Usually 1 1/2 - 2 months.