Trust me, if UAL/US comes to be, then it'll be a bloodbath the likes of which none of us have ever seen.

There is no way if they merge the USAir name would be kept. They simply don't have the same brand recognition overseas. And if UAL mgmt stays in control, you can kiss good bye to any wholy-owned regionals. Anyone thinking that a merger would be a good thing for PDT/PSA is smoking crack....

As far AWAC as is concerned, I'm pretty sure we'd be ******ed; Anyone who's been here long enough to have flown with UAL should be well aware that there's no such thing as "loyalty" when it comes to UAL and their express carriers. We have nothing but 50 seaters and we cost more. It's simple.

Aviatormar, AWAC gets paid for a flight whether they fly it or not. Airways pays for their fuel, which is a huge expense considering AWAC refuses to single engine taxi. These are just a few reasons why we are cheaper to operate than paying contract regionals. Not choosing sides, just stating facts. The head of Airways has stated he wants more flying from his wholly owneds. We have been approached by management to fly larger aircraft. All these are facts, not opinions.

I am trying to relay information here. Put your personal emotions away.

I have not believed any statement from AWAC or US Airways management. They are in it for themselves for the highest profit and will S&^T on any pilot group.. AWAC, PDT, PSA.. It is all the same. Cheap labor is thee goal and making it even cheaper is the #1 deal.

AWAC ownership has done a great job on the books and balancesheet, but forgot about the employee's who work planes. That is the crappy part, their greed has made this a "typical" regional to work for. It used to be an outstanding place and worth sticking around. Now- Not so much :(

We're all in this together, and it gets old seeing PSA douchebags saying

"OMG we are more important than AWAC because we are "wholly owned." Oh, and F* PDT too, they fly little props!"

Just shut up, listen up, and hopefully you won't be out of a job when all the dust settles.

That was awesome airwaves, and what the f does it mean to be wholly owned anyways? Being tied to a dying ship sucks.

PSA= Crappy Product and 300 Hour FO's with backpacks

AWAC= Quality product and respectable crews

Wholly owned's better watch out, if UAL/Airways merge, I have a feeling you'll be gone.

I'm tied to the dying ship, but I get sick of guys having some messed up superiority complex in regards to Republix and AWAC.

You have class! How's those hats, and being crapped on by everyone? Liking PHL? Grow up. Your airplanes are trash, the seats are ridiculously uncomfortable. Worst ever.

Is that the kind of response you wanted, have some civility.

Wow, you all get on Texas Pilot's case for "ripping" on AWAC but then a few of you completely tear into PSA. Real professional and mature (I'm looking in your direction DMEarc).

DX Rick is that you?

Amen brother!

Single Engine Taxi on an RJ is pointless....the airplane is under powered to begin with.....so instead using 2 engines at low thrust to move a 53000 lbs airplane....lets double the fuel flow to one engine instead...its not worth it

from a MX standpoint it doesnt add up either....you dont have equal engine wear....especially when your not giving that second engine any time to warm up right before u take the runway....its does more damage in the long run than it does saving gas.

thanks for the support as well guys...glad im not the only one who felt offended

I don't work for Air Wisconsin.

I have however commuted on both and formed my own opinion.

Well there's got to be some point to it or they wouldn't do it. But of course we're all 300-hr backpack-toting, douchebags who work for a company who apparently treats us terrible and doesn't pay us (if you really looked at the payscales, aviatormar and groovinaviatior you'd see that PSA captain pay is more - who cares about F/O pay when the upgrade, which I know will slow down a little bit, is only 12-18 months).

arent they cancelling your upgrade classes?

and our payscales are higher than yours....add the trip and duty rigs on top of that...it works out to alot more money

PSA likely won't get 90 seat jets; why should US Airways use what little access they they have to finance and capital markets to buy RJs?

Nobody is going to grow at the regionals for a very, VERY long time...unless its at the expense of another airline.

It's great you aren't bashful about making a fool out of yourself in public. SE taxi in the CRJ is a joke, and a non-issue. AWAC doesn't let you do it because you clowns would probably take the runway with just one turning and be like, ohhhh crap.

What he said.

This is great! I love when people fight about BS.

Who knows what the hell is going to happen. I just hope it doesn't send a bunch of people out looking for a new job.

Owned by Airways doesn't necessarily help...If they want to cut overhead....bye bye.
They might need the tax write-offs from paying AWAC more than having you operate a little cheaper.

AWAC's contract is not unbreakable....Every contract can be broken.

If anyone has any inside info, we would love to hear it.

Good luck everyone.

Thats like saying: All the companies that buy new planes with more automation don't trust their crews to operate the aircraft properly.

I think the reason AWAC doesn't SE taxi, they don't pay for fuel. Its less wear on the engines (cost to AWAC) than worry about the fuel savings(cost to Airways). ;)

What would you do?

I agree. But on the other hand you are not considered overhead if you are making money. But who knows.. Let the my airline is better than your airline peter fight begin!

just looking through this thread makes me queasy at how at home regionals are when it comes to whipsawing.
looks to me like RAH and SKTW see it as a threat and they are positioning their companies to contol the number of bidders.
these groups are going to have to have a single seniorty list via a peitition to the NMB.
Better yet, a National Seniority List on the regional level or prepare to be compromised.

Right cuz I remember a memo came out when we did single engine taxi, that it was no longer allowed because pilots were apparently forgetting that we had 2 thrust levers.

Grow up......you've got no grounds for accusing us for anything...joking or not...its uncalled for

They canceled 2 upgrade classes. That's it. And of course there won't be any upgrades for a little while but most other regionals won't be upgrading a ton of pilots in the near future anyways. If AWAC's upgrade is already around 3 years, I can't see it being any faster than PSA's. You can pay your F/O's all you want but I'll be the one making 60+ and building PIC as a captain in 3 years (just an example) and you're making 35 as a F/O and logging the oh-so-important SIC. 60 > 35

Everybody's $he-hit stinks. AWAC folks love their employer they made this site, http://www.doihaveafuturehere.org/. This makes me think it's not so great. PSA, PDT, SkyWest, Pinnacle -- pick one -- they all have problems. Who give a flying flip how bad it is at an airline where s/he doesn't work? If you don't like the the place you work, move on.

"Wholly owned" is not synonymous "safe." One of the regionals that has recently passed into the history books, Skyway, was a wholly owned. Paying lease fines can be cheaper than paying $4-5/gal for JetA. Also, T-props rule and will spank an rj on DOC in a 2-300nm (ie true REGIONAL) leg.

Why are they (PDT/PSA) cheaper? Airways can cx a flight and not have to pay. They operate without a profit margin factored in. They are an expense that provides a means to selling more tickets by bring more pax through the system.

Wasn't there a rumor that TK told the execs they might have 18 months to find a new job if the merger closes?

I though I read something in an AP/Reuters/thestreet.com report that United would be the "surviving carrier" in an AirTran/ValueJet way, ie surviving in name only. Could be totally wrong, but UAL did report over a $500M loss last quarter.


If you fly a 50 seat RJ...watch out. Nobody is "untouchable."

Riigggghhhhhttttt, have another duddddeeeeee. Ok, we don't single engine taxi, our MX feels it's pointless. We have pretty good work rules, of course they could be better, but lets face it, we are all underpaid. But I still want to say there is no need for a PSA d-bag to call an AWAC a**-hat a d-bag. Being wholly owned can simply mean that airways says, sorry guys ya'll are costing too much, good bye and put your flying up for bid. On the flip, we cost alot and now that airways and yo-united is sleeping with each other now, we all know how much of a hard-on they have for AWAC. We can be the next to go, let's just all go with the flow. Ohh and as far as making more money then me, umm if you add up the years that I'm make more as an FO which sucks, then the move to captain with our trip and duty rigs, yeah booiii I'm out ahead. But in this case it's like being the tallest on the short bus, not cool.

Arguing about pay is just pointless because we all get underpaid (but of course does anyone complain about getting overpaid at any position). I never have been involved in name-calling. I can't vouch for all of my fellow employees or employees of other airlines but I like to stay clear of that.

Aviatormar - you are right...MX doesn't care one bit about single-engine taxi...no matter when you spin it, it is still only ONE cycle. The ones who really DO care are the folks at Airways footing your fuel bill...that is a boat-load of cash you're burning each and every day!

Alright, well if you want some facts then let me point this out. GE went around to different airlines to try to get them to fly and operate the engines how AWAC does. We literally have engines that are original to the frames they are attached to. One thing that helps them is not single engine taxing, it cokes up the blades and doesn't do anything but hurt the engines, but I'm crazy, so who cares? But then again, I only wear 3 strips, and we all know what that stands for not-my-problem..... I'm messing around, I do care, my job is literally on the line with these fuel prices.

Are you serious?!?! FYI In the airline industry the current trend means NOTHING!!!! The only thing you an count on is your upgrade time WON'T be as expected.

Thanks for your opinion though......

1st, air whiskey is a great group of pilots, very generous with their jumpseats and down to Earth, friendly and strong work ethics.

Secondly, single engine taxi for a CRJ thats close to its takeoff weight doesn't make sense in PHL until you have crossed runway 27R.

The breakaway thrust, minimum taxi thrust and resultant fuel burn to turn from the push point, clear the ramp, taxi down echo and expeditiously cross the active runway (27R) on one engine is more than two engine taxi.

So, I wouldn't shut down the left engine until I was in the stop-and-go traffic on sierra leading up to the 27L - when you're 3 minutes from t/o, start it back up.

And finally, back to the thread (sale of shares and leaving board):
I'm keeping my fingers crossed, for this fine pilot group, that everything will be okay.

I just wish each airline would just raise fares to cover the increase and fuel and the cost of living increase for its crews.

Sure, you'll lose some to the LCCs.

Do they have the capacity to handle all of the flying public???

Great posting. Thank you.

The fact is that nobody here really knows what is going on behind the scenes.
Maybe AWAC sold the shares to get cash to buy the Horizon 700's.
Maybe they are breaking away from Airways to grow with other carriers. Maybe they are getting into the turbo prop business.

MAYBE they are going to buy Midwest from NWA!!! :eek: Betcha weren't thinking about that one!

Time will tell. Hang on everybody. This is going to be a bumpy few years for everybody. Best of luck.

SmoothOnTop, thank you very much for those kind word about my fellow co-workers and I, you and anyone else is always welcomed on my jumpseat (as long as the captain says it's ok, hey I'm only an FO after all).

There is something that has always baffled my mind about airlines. Pilots overall view of each other. I don't look at another airline and see flying for myself. I see another pilot with a job to feed his family.


It sucks and in the current business world if your not growing then your shrinking, and growing is at the expense of someone elses job. The more future industrial standards show down sizing on all fronts. So, if one gets the X we all lose!

If and when United and U.S. Airways merge the overlapping of routes and ground stations would be so great that everyone who flies them will be affected wholly owned or not. We are all going to succeed or were all going to suffer.

I have met many fine people at PSA and I fly with a lot of good people here at AWAC and I've flown with a few D-Bags here too.

The main thing is we are all in this together. ALPA 4-EVER!!!

Eeeeaaaaaasssy there... that's why I put "example" in parenthesis because one can't count on the current trend. So please read all of the words before freaking out and falling out of your chair.

I have never denied a jumpseater and only once denied a non-rev. And that was because I already had to deny a revenue passenger. The only jumpseaters I would deny are basically GoJet. I took an ex-PSA guy once and he was great. Very nice, thankful and informative about his current job.

Anyway, none of us is better than the next. 'Cept me. :D And I'm an AWACer and native cheesehead. Been to EAA more times than most of the backpackers have birthdays.

Fly safe, we're all in this together, drink beer, have fun, talk dirty and don't think too much about it. K?

Thank You Very Much Smooth:cool:

your "just an example" suggests that you are stating one of a few facts. If you were to add the word "possible" than it would have been taken the way you intended it to be taken. I think everyones upgrades are going to slow down.

You are right though....we are all underpaid.

Just saw an local ad for flight Instructors....$40k first year!

Speaking of single-engine taxi, for those who wonder why the reckless, irresponsible, knowledgeless AWAC pilots would not do it, here's why:

1. Our company does not have a policy permitting it.
2. Our pilots try hard to follow company procedures.
3. Those procedures exist for a reason.
4. They are determined by people who think about these things and do a lot of research on them.
5. General Electric has a stake in this, and has recommended we DON'T do a single-engine taxi procedure.
6. The fuel savings is minimal, at best. Folks who are smart have calculated this.
7. Our company encourages common sense, including shutting one engine or both engines down if idle at one spot for a long time.
8. AWAC has been a survivor for a long time and has been so due to some smart folks at the helm who see larger things than we might. (yeah, I might disagree with them sometimes, but I have a job and am getting paid on time, better than most 50-seat capts.)
9. The Paulaner Hefe-Weizen is tasty.
10. We need to be back in ORD.
11. We need to get rid of the 50-seaters....

so there....