Saab to Q?
 

Straight forward question. How is the transition from saab to Q for all you other colgan guys that have made it? Positives and Negatives. Thanks

The question is what it does to your wallet. I have enough spare change in my kids piggy bank. That is what I would like to know is it worth it $.

Any Colgan FO that moves from the Saab to the Q for same pay is crazy. 74 seats for $21/hr 1st year then $26/hr 2nd year?

Why would Colgan/PNCL mgmt ever pay more for Q pilots when Saab guys are moving over for the same pay?

Quiet Prop Syndrome

That is so sad. You should be figuring out how not to fly that thing if there going to give you NO increase in pay.

Hmmm same pay, Saab goes slower, I'd say there's NO reason to switch. Same thing I told the FO's at Mesaba that switched from Saab to CR9. Those that didn't listen are learning the hard way now....

isnt fo pay the same for all types at chq republic and shuttle?

If the pay is the same for all equipment the only reason I could see switching is to be based at home.

Yep, negotiated long before the 170 existed. Aircraft are also cruising at the same speed so on similar stage lengths the pay is going to be the same. You can't say that for the Saab/Q comparison.

Cruise speed does not matter in this comparison. The Q may cruise faster but it is based out of EWR so more time on the ground waiting, so it washes.

The bottom line is the Q holds more than twice that of the Saab. You are carrying twice as much revenue for the company for the same pay as the 34 seater Saab.

We now know there are at least 15 more Q's coming and FO's willing to fly it for peanuts is crazy.

I bet if you account for inflation, we're flying 70-seat RJs for the same pay we got back in the 1980s flying 30 seat turboprops.

Dont you mean mesa??

Not originally but if it's the same there than fine

We now know there are at least 15 more Q's coming and FO's willing to fly it for peanuts is crazy.[/QUOTE]

What do you except us to do, hold our management hostage until we get more pay. I think your crazy! You have no idea what the reasoning is behind my choice of move. Instead of calling people crazy us that have jobs should be greatful, not nit picking every negative thing out there

I really don't think it's fair to single out Colgan for poor pay on a large turboprop. Just look at Eagle, for example. There is no pay difference there eithere for FO's flying the Saab or the ATR-72. And according to this website, the 2nd year pay is only $1 off. Granted it widens a bit beyond that, but it's nothing eye-opening. Look at Pinnacle, 2nd year pay to fly a jet is less than Colgan's 2nd year pay to fly a Saab or Q! Why is it that no one is criticizing Pinnacle for this?

As for the original poster, I hope someone actually answers your question here, instead of slinging mud.

Brewpilot, if you can hold the right seat of the Q400, TAKE IT. That airplane will look good on the resume, its much heavier and complex. Some guy might tell you not to do it, but when his number comes up he'll jump on it.......PIC on the saab still better if you just want to wait

What do you except us to do, hold our management hostage until we get more pay. I think your crazy! You have no idea what the reasoning is behind my choice of move. Instead of calling people crazy us that have jobs should be greatful, not nit picking every negative thing out there[/QUOTE]

"Hostage"?

Yeah, I held them hostage when THEY TOLD ME no more run up pay....
and no taxi pay....
and reduced "hesitation pay"....


I don't know what your reasoning is, but it seems to me the only smart reason for an FO to take the Q right now is that he/she already lives in base (or an easier commute). The pay scale is the same for both planes so no benefit there. From the numbers I am hearing, upgrade time in the Q will be longer (not that upgrade, in either ac, for a new hire is even on the horizon).

Now, about being "grateful"... I am grateful I chose to work for a Turboprop company. Prop companies have fared better (furlough wise) than jets. I am grateful I chose a prop company that was growing. I am NOT SO GRATEFUL that when contract talks begin, I will give away everything just to have a job.

Pretty close :(

I made out well with it....

Depends on who's turboprop rates you're looking at. In some cases, we're getting paid LESS when you account for inflation.

Well guys and Galls if ya'll look at Colgans senority list you will see that over 90% of F/Os on the Q were hired in 08 which means they were hired for that aircraft and not transitioned from the saab. Most of the other F/Os were displaced from the removal of the mighty Beech from airframe inventory and sever down sizing on the US Airways Saab ops. Colgan had policy in effect that said no transitions to to or from the same paygrade. Hence the no F/O to F/O. I dont know if this is still in effect or not.

Now to go back to the original question since no one has answered it. Most Captains enjoyed the transition. This is not the first time being trained in a new aircraft so you are more at easy. If you are coming from the Saab its simpler. They seemed to try and rebuild the Saab with pointless numbers and system knowledge that goes way beyond most maintenance personel. The Q was very cut and dry. Yes it also looks better on a resume to show aircrafts at 65k weights as apossed to 29k or 17k depending on what you have flown.

Having spent many years in the Saab Id have to say that it was a much stronger aircraft than the Q but they both have their strenghts. An FMS is nice but they don't call it a gotcha airplane for nothing!

I would not come to the Q since the senior FOs will be passed if and when upgrades come due to their new 12 month FO seatlock in the Q. It will hurt me short term as far as bidding with a few guys over me but help me in the long run when there are a few less guys able to bid SF340 CA due to their seatlocks.

The bad thing about being a Q FO is the majority is pretty junior to most Saab FO's. So when the Q deliveries start coming in over the next few years many of the new Q CA's will be Saab CA transitions to the Q, senior Saab FO's will replace those CA's on the Saabs and so on.

Because of this I would not be surprised to see Q FO's take upgrade in the Saab first and transition over when there seniority can hold it.

Smart move, sounds like you got your head on straight.
I used to give the same advice to FOs I used to fly with when I worked there.
Getting that PIC time is key, if both planes pay the same as a FO why bother?
Best of luck.

Exactly, I will be bidding whichever I can hold left seat first in. Of course common sense says that it will be the saab which is not a problem at all. I will keep my seat warm until a seat somewhere in the system opens up for me which at this point will probably be a year to a year and a half or so. 3 year FO pay here I come.

The one thing with Colgan is you never know. If those Q's come online and the movement continues over to that side of the operation you will probably be back in St. Louis before you know it.

Can't beat that mexican place down the block from the Holiday Inn.
:D

I have never run into a potential or actual employer that has ever cared how much your airplane weighed because it really does not matter. But if that is how you want to justify it go right ahead.

Just because you haven't doesn't mean anything. Fill out an application with a foreign career, like Cathay, and you'll see.

Add Jetblue to your list.

Definatly Jet Blue Mr. Foreman.