Pinnacle contract progress
 

So the last email from SE sounded promising...moving from 29 areas of disagreement to 9 in 2 weeks is good progress. Meeting again for 3 days at the beginning of May...so, wadaya think? Contract coming soon with ponies, new boots, and thousands of dollars for everyone? or more tactics to boost moral before the next round of delay tactics?

I read that email yesterday and was wondering when someone was going to post up about it. I have to agree that sounded very positive compared to updates from the past, but I voted by the end of 09 anyway.

I don't think the company will let it get so far as a strike, but they will be delaying as long as possible. The delay will be easier now that everyone is happy about the progress being made.

Rumor is, Daddy Delta says get contract done or more flying to be lost...we lost 1500hrs for May and Delta says 4500 more coming if no contract.

good luck. phildo make 1.4mil in total compensation in 08. I think it should be taken out of his ass

I gave this one to our MEC head and he said that was not the case. The company did say they wanted a contract done yesterday (obviously this is a 2-sided event). The 9 open sections are economic and are always the difficult ones to get done. At least we are up to the meat of the contract. It's only been 5 years! Keep in mind this tactic has been used repeatedly to scare us from the back of the company. Management can quickly "leak" such a rumor from the management pilots and it hits the line like the plague- before you know it people who are very "plugged in" begin to even think it may be the case. Reference summer 2006- "Last, best, final offer or we lose all the NWA flying without a new service agreement". The union said no, rightfully so because the offer on the table was not good, and the pilots got the saturday fedex package.


That being said, my expectations are up. Politically we are getting into warm labor waters, and management is doing all that it can to hold on. Reference the latest displacements and continued JM's, extensions, memos. All they have in their arsenal is fear and a determination to destroy QOL. We shall see...

I think the voting numbers speak for themselves.

But let's not forget how Barney LOVES to go back and re- open TA'd sections......I think he eats his notes and forgets what the agreements were.:mad:

Why isn't "Never" an option for this poll?

I do smell a contract coming very soon. Now, the problem is, is it going to get my vote. There are many things I will be looking for for it to get my YES. The biggest one is how big is my bonus check going to be. Ive been here for 5 years through the whole time the contract has been amendable. If we were to get retro pay I would be getting at least 25,000 bucks. So, with that I want to see at least a 10000 dollar bonus after taxes. I am cutting them a pretty big break. If I dont see that then its a NO from me.

why are you cutting them a break?

first off you aren't giving the company a break. got some bad news for the both of you. the company doesn't care how much of a signing bonus you personally get and to be honest its non of their business. the union will negotiate a lump sum payment due to the union. it could be 10 milllion or a 100 million. then the UNION, our elected guys will divy up the money. they are the ones we need to be talking to and discussing this with. so even if the company gave the union 100 million dollars for the signing bonus you could still get the shaft if the union decided to give large sums of money to they guys who have been here over 8 years, and everyone else below that gets a stipened.

our elected officials are going to be the ones giving out the bonuses. i have heard some pretty fair things to some that make me go ygtbkm. so the best thing to do is to talk to they guys on the comittee and hope they aren't super senior pilots writing themselves a large bonus.

There are soo many factors that are involved between a signing bonus and the things you want in a contract. Think about it..... You COULD get a fat signing bonus and a lower hourly rate, no BOB, 50% DH/CXX, and you would be OK with that, but over the next 5 years you may actually LOSE a considerable amount of money over the timespan with a lower signing bonus but higher pay protections, pay rates, and QOL provisions. Keep in mind our pilot costs of the "industry average" caliber get sent right through to daddy DL, and being that we are relatively junior in the longevity area (average pay range of the pay scale of pilots) vs. other DCI's we are still going to be cheap at no cost to the company. As I have the situation understood a signing bonus comes out of the company's acct, so there is added benefit for all of us to have a pretty good contract instead of a massive lumpsum bonus. There is also many reasons (many tax related) as to why we and the company want a SIGNING BONUS vs. Retro. Signing bonus helps us both.


For specific questions call or email a rep, that why they volunteered!

Having only been here 2 years, I dont really care about a signing bonus, I havent been around long enough to deserve one. Those on the list prior to the amendable date are the guys that should get first crack at a bonus. If there's anything left by the time it hits my seniority number, great, if not, no big loss.

But in order to get a Yes vote from me, I need to see #1 Good Work Rules, #2, Industry average or better Pay, #3, Solid contract language. if I dont see at least those 3 things, it'll be a NO. My strike fund is well funded.

I agree on your 3. That's my same list except I have a #4 of good retirement match..

I don't want to burst any of your bubbles but...

PNCL Corp owes 110 million note due Feb 2010. They are trying to figure out how to pay that to keep the airline going, let alone giving the union a big lump sum. They have been selling Colgan SAAB Engines to raise money.

You guys should be happy with a slighty higher than industry average contract. That is what Phildo is going to offer, but certainly no big financial obligations due in the near term. They just don't have the money.

I disagree with that. FO's are taking the brunt of this horrible contract, our rates are $10,000 a year lower than most FO's at other regionals. Most FO's who don't have money coming in from family are either deeply in debt, living like hobos, or barely getting by. Captains on the other hand, may be getting paid less than average, but as a % compared to their peers, they are much better off than FO's. They were all able to upgrade in 1-2 years, and the impact of the low FO rates was minimal. This is no longer the case.

And Pinnacle does have the money for the bonds/lump sum, unfortunately it's still tied up in auction rate securities. The value of those securities is definitely not par value, but they do have value, they just are very illiquid at this point.

Let's not forget they're "getting back" roughly 15 million dollars on their bottom line for 1st quarter '09 that they thought they would have as a tax liability:

Pinnacle, IRS reach $3 million settlement - Triangle Business Journal:

They're not actually "getting" cash on hand for anything, but their balance sheet will look a little better

I don't want to see a massive bonus check that bankrupts the company, however the note due in Feb 2010 is not going to destroy the company...look at Mesa, who is in a way worse position than 9E--they renogotiated the terms of their debt...if Mesa can get creditors off it's back, I'm pretty sure Philly boy can. I know some people who have some unjustified fears that management will set up golden parachutes for themselves and willingly bankrupt/raid the company...I don't think that will happen at 9E, since most of our shareholders are institutional investors with large numbers of shares and legal clout who would literally go ape crazy if they saw something like that developing

For those who dont know the company has already set aside 15 mil for the bonuses, so thats already done. Its now just how the union splits it up between us all.

I didn't think you guys cared about the contract, after all you guys are going to leave as soon as you get your 1,000 hours PIC.

So I guess nothing matters to you guys except the signing bonus.:D

Seeing that pretty much all your posts about regionals are negative towards pinnacle and totally against ALPA I guess you really know what's going on.

Would you have bashed 9E and ALPA if the union signed off on the "last, best, final" offer a few years ago keeping the bar at a level barney could clear?

If it's a limbo that's gotta be a pretty high bar!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was thinking more like a hurdle so it would be low.....

King Lear...what's your beef with 9E? Your post history shows a surprising lack of criticism of other ALPA carriers. Methinks you have it out for this company, and I wanna know specifically why...

bump...are we released yet??? :D

i am waiting on the email since today was the last scheduled day of negotiations. to bad they dont come till around midnight.

So nobody has any rumors to spread??? I'm a little surprised that no info has come out yet. Do we at least know whether or not they have wrapped things up for this round or if they extended it out???

I honestly care less about the contract than the bonus being in my hands and a good one. Contracts are conceded on a regular basis now. Does it need to be very good after the wait? Yeah. But the signing bonus is money in my pocket right now, no chance of them taking it back. give me that...and make it big. they must pay for the free money we've lent them these last 4 years.

Here's the rumor I've heard (not from a great source mind you): We've agreed on 4 more issues as of 2 days ago...5 more to go, all big. Also, same person said Mesaba and Comair to merge...doubtful imo but stranger things have happened.

Nothing has been said, therefore no rumors... When the leaks start the fun begins. I have already sent off messages looking for answers and everyone is playing the quiet game. **shrug**

I smell a TA around the corner, I can honestly say that for the first time in 5 years.

Yeah, Trenery's A-hole leaves a pretty big stink trail. Keep sniffin, nothings coming.

Well the email finally came out and still no contract. Not that I am surprised. Apparently they made some more progress, but "a comprehensive agreement has still been illusive."

We will hear back once the next round has been scheduled :(

Your raise will come from all the money they have left over after they settle the lawsuits from the Colgan crash.

Lots of luck, at least your tax bracket will not change.

boy you must be a joy to wake up to in the morning. Something tells me you're single.....?:rolleyes:

Actually, Pinnacle Holding made it clear in the past two investor conference calls that they're insured to 100% against anything (including negligence and associated lawsuits). This won't cost them a dime other than maybe some lawyer fees.

I might know who King Lear is...pretty sure he might be a guy who got fired before he finished probation...J.S.???

No more freebee's Its your money that was owed to you and you deserve every penny after Uncle Sam take's his share. I understand the company's stance for the bonus.. but they are still coming out on top. Could you imagine if the contract was voted down because the pilot group wanted back pay.. that 1.2 mil uncle Phil made last year would be recalled by the board. He walked away with over 400K in bonus's.... at the cost of your labor.