RAH purchases: The good and the bad
 

If you're hoping for an economic recovery that will aid the airline industry, RAH's purchase of Midwest is a very good sign. Usually, aquisitions are a sure sign the economy has either bottomed or is growing. I would go with the former right now.

Here's the bad as I see it though. Were I a pilot on furlough from RAH, I would be very unhappy that the money is available to buy other airlines, but not keep me employed. That's probably a poor way to look at things, but that would be my view.

I do hope these purchases are a sign of better things to come for the industry though.

There is language built into the current contract protecting RAH furloughs in the case of a merger. They'll be back very soon.

Time will tell I guess. RAH Pilots are in a GREAT position, they have the ability to really get what they DESERVE, of course now Mr Bedford could cry that he has no money to pay them cause he just spent it all, haha

absolutely crazy,

Perhaps the RAH pilots will learn from the Airways integration debacle and ensure that Midwest and Frontier guys are base, seat, and pay protected. Even the furloughees. If RAH is going to stop selling it to every major with an open checkbook and become an actual airline (instead of a merely a lift sub-contractor) I think the pilot group would benefit from the experience those guys have.

On the other hand RAH's pilots outnumber Midwest and Frontier pilots combined by 2 to 1. Its not inconceivable that they all get stapled to the bottom of RAH's list and Captains with 10 to 20 years experience wind up junior to RAH pilots who were literally still in diapers when these "New Hires" started at MidEx or Frontier.

Do you know how a parasite works? It feeds off it's host. The host could be dying, however the parasite is living a healthy life.

That is exactly what RAH is doing. It is not a sign of economic recovery, it is just based on the fact that RAH has been feeding off the major airlines they serve and now have become their own competition. The truth is that RAH has been sheltered from this economic storm. They do not have to pay for fuel, and they could care less about how many people are on their airplanes, they get paid regardless.

This is not perfect for the employees, it is more hit and run, go see who makes the cash on this deal and you will find they have done this before and will try the model again. This is all about cash and how it can be made quickly. Sorry to say, so many pilots are blindsighted over this and think in the now, however there is an end to this and once the model costs exceed the plan this will be shut down. Unless like you said the host dies first.

Every airline has this problem, as the employee group matures, so does the fixed costs and ultimately will fail. This is why the management types jump so much, they know.

There's a good side to a low-paid regional buying 2 mainline carriers, one of which they've already voiced their intention to replace the mainline jets with their own metal?

RAH to Acquire Midwest Airlines - Yahoo! Finance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahoo! Finance
Under the agreement, Midwest will become a wholly owned subsidiary of Republic Airways, with the Midwest brand continuing. Midwest’s Boeing 717s will be replaced with Embraer 190 aircraft, enhancing Midwest’s ability to offer nonstop service to key destinations important to its frequent flyers.
What's unclear is if the 190s will be flown by Midwest pilots displaced off the 717 or Republic pilots with hardons for bigger airplanes. Given RAH's history, the AA/TWA precedent and the way the Midwest work groups have been treated throughout this whole ordeal, it would not surprise me one bit if the Midwest guys are pounding pavement in a year, watching their brand being flown by pilots who have to sleep on their parent's couch just to make ends meet.

Bryan Bedford, destroying lives one airline at a time.

Would you have rather them die, so you have no job at all?

Or provides a bailout for 2 failing airlines so those employees still have a paycheck.


I'm so tired of the holier that thou attitude from the same posters on this site. Either you are happy to at least have a chance at your job being there. Or you too proud to fly a little plane for less money. Pick one please. I'd rather see you burn it to the ground honestly. I so tired of the drama of the situation being put on the shoulders of RAH pilots.

You are naive if you think that a weak carrier (in this case Frontier and Midwest) being purchased by a stronger carrier (RAH) always turns out for the best for those at the weak carrier. I think there are a couple thousand former TWA guys who would be willing to put things in perspective for you. The short story is AA got their airplanes and their jobs while they were left in the cold.

To the OP: The carrier does not owe a job. If you hired a high school kid to mow your lawn every week and then a huge drought came along and your grass stopped growing, would you continue to pay the kid if there was no grass to mow? You'd likely tell them there is no work and potentially rehire him only when the grass grows again. The fact that the kid sees you drive up in your Mercedes and curses the fact that you aren't paying him in reality makes no difference to you because you owe him nothing beyond consideration for mowing your lawn. The fact that the airline has money has no bearing on the fact that they should keep you aboard so you don't go without money. Their loyalty is not to you, it is to the owners. You are instantly replaceable.

As pilots, we feel some sort of entitlement because we can fly an airplane and went to school. Pilots are just background noise - this is not what I believe, this is what management believes and it shows everyday.

The whole pilot profession right now just seems like trying to walk with your shoe laces tied together and not realizing what the problem is. The problem follows you around. You can look around at the world all day and curse about the reasons you can't walk, but the reality is you must reach down and solve the problem yourself. As long as the masses have the rationale of "At least you have a job and a check", the shoe laces will stay tied. All shorts of shenanigans can and will occur in the industry, all led by and hence to the benefit of the owners (NOT YOU), and so long as pilots disparately cling to the prospect of a paycheck out of fear to make a bold move and reserve their feelings of hostility to this board, conversations at cruise, etc, it will get worse and worse and worse.

This board has nothing to do with flying. The thing we all love is just background noise to this fighting, bickering, ICALL thread closings, union debates, rumor mills, etc. What is it that keeps people coming after this profession? There are other ways to fly and MANY other ways to make money.

If even a respectable fraction of the folks on here who complain left and rightly put their actions where their mouths are and GET OUT, the problems would in many ways solve themselves naturally for those who stay behind.

Too many bodies in the kitchen all fighting over a scrap. "Its my scrap". "No, its my scrap". "My mom made it, not yours. Doesn't that entitle me to the scrap over you?" "But my mom disowned me and I am older than you, so shouldn't I be entitled to that scrap your mom made?" "I heard Bobby's mom is going to take care of all of us now!" "But Bobby's mom has already disowned her own kids, how is she going to take care of us?" "I dunno, I just need a scrap!!!"

Great post!

I never said the airline owed furloughed pilots a job. I said, where I on furlough, I would be unhappy the company could make these aquisitions, but not be able to keep me employed. That's very different from saying the airline owes the pilots a job at the cost of aquisitions that could be beneficial for the bottom line.

Best post I've read on this board in a long time.

Wow, thats deep, that is the best description of the current state of Aviation, I have heard todate....:D

I agree with and can relate to the analogies put forward. I consider myself to be more of an independent contractor than an "employee" to/for an airline. I bid on jobs every month and I am awarded the ones that my longevity with the organization will afford me.

Just like any other independent contractor, you don't mean that much to the company who hires you, they just want you to get the job done with as few hiccups as possible. That being said, your own well-being is in your hands. Provide an escape plan for yourself and realize that someday the golden goose may stop laying eggs, at which point you'll have to start at the bottom again.

I think its interesting how many people here are still living under the belief (albeit illusion) that life is fair.

Amen brother! How many times as a kid did you hear "sometimes life isn't fair". It seems like that's all we end up doing as adults, and especially as pilots, is squabble about whats fair, who's being fair, who's being unfair and why that may or may not be so. I think we would ALL (pilots, doctors, laborers, janitors, etc) be a lot better off if we were more conscious of the fact that life kicks everyone in the balls from time to time and, that while it may hurt like hell for a while, its not the end of the world. Instead of thumping your chest and whining about how it's not fair, just ice up, rest up and get ready to kick back the next time the opportunity arises.

My guess...These purchases are for no other reason than to get around scope at DAL and UAL.:( In less than a year Republic will open a ATL base with 190's in Midwest paint operated under an at risk codeshare in order to drive Airtran down in ATL and MKE. What I thinks gonna happen with Frontier is a little more complex but with a similar intent...On another note unless your happy with a career at a regional I think its time to get out:(

Give this man a standing ovation. Well said.

Yup, that thought occurred to most of them about six months ago. And bryris should be speaking at the congressional hearings.

THere will be no stapling, this from the Republic EXCO. The Midwest pilots will be merged via Allegheny/Mohawk and we will fight to the death for the Frontier pilots to be on the seniority list. Frankly if the Frontier pilots don't fight along with us to merge the list things will get even uglier as they will most likely be out of a job altogether when the 190's roll in and half the Buses are shelved.

Give us some breathing room to get some payscales and lock down these mergers. I know now that most all of your wildest dreams of Mesa failing seem to be on the door step you have to find someone new to beat. Just lighten up and offer something constructive instead of the crap I keep reading. And for crying out loud, you can't change anything so stop whining about it.

In STL I see tons of ex TWA guys that are making nice paychecks.

Why should the airline keep you employed when there simply is not the flying available? If I own store and I have to lay off employees for lack of business, should that prevent me from purchasing the store next to mine to better my store as a whole?

I don't know if thats the best analogy, but hope you get my drift. I'm furloughed too, so I understand that the flying simply is not there to keep my employed. If my regional decided to go buy another airline, I won't get mad that thats money they could be paying me.

So I guess in your view, all is well. What about the hundreds of TWA guys on the street--that you don't see--that aren't making that nice paycheck?

You, sir, are as deep as a paper plate.

X

Nice? Relative to your paycheck, I guess it's nice.