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Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 674116)
your right that most of us at places with decent contracts didnt earn those contracts in negotiations but WE DID CHOOSE our carrier for those reasons. DId we go to the first place to say yes? probably not. Those places with halfway decent contracts were harder to get hired at way back when everyone was hiring.
In my opinion, you and every colgan employee should be ashamed of how you are treated and paid. You ARE NOT a small turbo-prop carrier anymore and its time to quit being sorry for yourselves. Your pilot group is pathetic for working under those conditions for that small amount of pay for the amount of lift you are providing. I know your company has it problems but there are ways to show solidarity and to get your point across to management via slowdowns and maintenance right ups. I am afraid that wont happen because of the caliber of applicant who your company hired who are just happier then pigs in mud to be employed and getting a measly paycheck. Good thing those people worked so hard to earn those contracts before your company decided to swoop in and undermine their hard work. Your company flying those airplanes has brought the pay and work rules that were previously on that lift back to the stone ages. You want us to be excited for you guys starting negotiations? The negotiations have been ongoing well before your company decided to fly airplanes for CAL. the arrival of the q400 operated by colgan has been nothing but a major set back for pilot pay and work rules. Even if you do get a good contract with an industry leading pay rate.... just wait until someone comes in and underbids you. Great Lakes flying a q400 and expanding all over the place with brand new people too excited about shiny new airplanes to care about the profession or making a mortgage payment. |
Originally Posted by brewpilot
(Post 674146)
Management is the devil in this one
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Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 674116)
your right that most of us at places with decent contracts didnt earn those contracts in negotiations but WE DID CHOOSE our carrier for those reasons. DId we go to the first place to say yes? probably not. Those places with halfway decent contracts were harder to get hired at way back when everyone was hiring.
In my opinion, you and every colgan employee should be ashamed of how you are treated and paid. You ARE NOT a small turbo-prop carrier anymore and its time to quit being sorry for yourselves. Your pilot group is pathetic for working under those conditions for that small amount of pay for the amount of lift you are providing. I know your company has it problems but there are ways to show solidarity and to get your point across to management via slowdowns and maintenance right ups. I am afraid that wont happen because of the caliber of applicant who your company hired who are just happier then pigs in mud to be employed and getting a measly paycheck. Good thing those people worked so hard to earn those contracts before your company decided to swoop in and undermine their hard work. Your company flying those airplanes has brought the pay and work rules that were previously on that lift back to the stone ages. You want us to be excited for you guys starting negotiations? The negotiations have been ongoing well before your company decided to fly airplanes for CAL. the arrival of the q400 operated by colgan has been nothing but a major set back for pilot pay and work rules. Even if you do get a good contract with an industry leading pay rate.... just wait until someone comes in and underbids you. Great Lakes flying a q400 and expanding all over the place with brand new people too excited about shiny new airplanes to care about the profession or making a mortgage payment. When you go to work for a company, you're inherently voting YES to their current contract. |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 674116)
your right that most of us at places with decent contracts didnt earn those contracts in negotiations but WE DID CHOOSE our carrier for those reasons. DId we go to the first place to say yes? probably not. Those places with halfway decent contracts were harder to get hired at way back when everyone was hiring.
In my opinion, you and every colgan employee should be ashamed of how you are treated and paid. You ARE NOT a small turbo-prop carrier anymore and its time to quit being sorry for yourselves. Your pilot group is pathetic for working under those conditions for that small amount of pay for the amount of lift you are providing. I know your company has it problems but there are ways to show solidarity and to get your point across to management via slowdowns and maintenance right ups. I am afraid that wont happen because of the caliber of applicant who your company hired who are just happier then pigs in mud to be employed and getting a measly paycheck. Good thing those people worked so hard to earn those contracts before your company decided to swoop in and undermine their hard work. Your company flying those airplanes has brought the pay and work rules that were previously on that lift back to the stone ages. You want us to be excited for you guys starting negotiations? The negotiations have been ongoing well before your company decided to fly airplanes for CAL. the arrival of the q400 operated by colgan has been nothing but a major set back for pilot pay and work rules. Even if you do get a good contract with an industry leading pay rate.... just wait until someone comes in and underbids you. Great Lakes flying a q400 and expanding all over the place with brand new people too excited about shiny new airplanes to care about the profession or making a mortgage payment. Judging by your name, I'm guessing that you work for ExpressJet. If that is the case, then you are flying Continental Mainline routes for a quarter of the pay and a fraction of the work rules. Keep on knocking down the pilots at Colgan though, I'm sure it will help you out in your own career progression. |
Originally Posted by DeadHead
(Post 674211)
Assuming you work at a regional yourself, I am sure that your subsidized mainline counterpart may feel the same way about you and your company.
Judging by your name, I'm guessing that you work for ExpressJet. If that is the case, then you are flying Continental Mainline routes for a quarter of the pay and a fraction of the work rules. Keep on knocking down the pilots at Colgan though, I'm sure it will help you out in your own career progression. |
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 674116)
In my opinion, you and every colgan employee should be ashamed of how you are treated and paid. You ARE NOT a small turbo-prop carrier anymore and its time to quit being sorry for yourselves. Your pilot group is pathetic for working under those conditions for that small amount of pay for the amount of lift you are providing.
Originally Posted by newarkblows
(Post 674116)
Even if you do get a good contract with an industry leading pay rate.... just wait until someone comes in and underbids you. Great Lakes flying a q400 and expanding all over the place with brand new people too excited about shiny new airplanes to care about the profession or making a mortgage payment.
At least getting a real contract with real pay rates will be a step in the right direction. Hopefully it will be the first in a long series! |
Originally Posted by IQuitEagle
(Post 674244)
Aren't they at least trying to make things better? If they really were feeling "sorry" for themselves, they wouldn't even bother.
So now you're saying why bother at all?:confused: They should just keep the conditions that they have? That's hardly a solution. At least getting a real contract with real pay rates will be a step in the right direction. Hopefully it will be the first in a long series! |
Originally Posted by GlobeTreker
(Post 674292)
A common argument I hear repeatedly from Colgan pilots is "We are trying to change our airline. What have you done for the industry"? I think this a pretty lame argument. What kind of professional goes around looking for the most sh*&%y company they can find just so they can change it from the inside. What same person does this? I have never heard this argument outside of aviation. Everyone I know looks for the highest paying job at the best companies. Am I supposed to believe Colgan pilots are taking the fat chick home for the team?
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Originally Posted by IQuitEagle
(Post 674244)
Quote:
Originally Posted by newarkblows Even if you do get a good contract with an industry leading pay rate.... just wait until someone comes in and underbids you. Great Lakes flying a q400 and expanding all over the place with brand new people too excited about shiny new airplanes to care about the profession or making a mortgage payment. So now you're saying why bother at all? They should just keep the conditions that they have? |
Originally Posted by GlobeTreker
(Post 674292)
A common argument I hear repeatedly from Colgan pilots is "We are trying to change our airline. What have you done for the industry"? I think this a pretty lame argument. What kind of professional goes around looking for the most sh*&%y company they can find just so they can change it from the inside. What same person does this? I have never heard this argument outside of aviation. Everyone I know looks for the highest paying job at the best companies. Am I supposed to believe Colgan pilots are taking the fat chick home for the team?
that and, things actually did get a lot worse when pinnacle bought us. obviously colgan didnt have a top notch contract or anything but it wasnt nearly as bad before when it was run solely by the colgans. even i've seen the work rules deteriorating and i havent even been here as many years as others. those guys came when things were OK, and the situation turned crappy on them through mgmt's decisions and actions. |
Originally Posted by IQuitEagle
(Post 674244)
Aren't they at least trying to make things better? If they really were feeling "sorry" for themselves, they wouldn't even bother.
So now you're saying why bother at all?:confused: They should just keep the conditions that they have? That's hardly a solution. At least getting a real contract with real pay rates will be a step in the right direction. Hopefully it will be the first in a long series! Thank you... |
Originally Posted by minimwage4
(Post 674215)
Yea and you are flying continental mainline routes for 1/8th the pay and no work rules.
Secondly, Colgan is flying routes that are, for the most part, less than 400nm and not cost effective with a jet. Expressjet on the other hand, is technically flying routes that belong to mainline. In the 90's your company grew at the expense of mainline jobs. I'm not making the above point to berate, but I am sure that the Continental Pilots sitting on the sidewalk, waiting for that callback to work, may feel that your company is staffing their position at a fraction of what their pay should be.
Originally Posted by minimwage4
(Post 674215)
What is your point? Expressjet has one of the best airline contracts and 50 seat pay.
Most mainline pilots have fought tooth and nail over the years struggling for decent pay, fair work rules, and an overall better quality of life through their working agreements. What was the point in all that effort if at the end of the day mainline companies send all their flying down the river to companies who blatantly sidestep anything remotely close to a respectable agreement in exchange for that promise of that dream job one day? The biggest difference I've seen between the mainline level and the regional level of this industry is the complete lack of respect for your regional counterparts. Most mainline pilots are more interested in what is going on in "their house" while being as optimistic and supportive about what is going on in peers' houses. It's always easier to blame other companies for your own misfortunes I guess, however it lacks both the dignity and class that were both once a big part of this industry. |
For all you guys who are dogging Colgan, how dare you call yourselves respectable airline pilots. The biggest problem with ALPA or any other union in this fuqued up industy is he lack of support and brotherhood from FELLOW union members. Man up and support us during this important time, or keep your disdain quietly to yourself. Management is laughing at our disorganization. I'll be the first to congradulate and support ANY pilot groups fight to improve anything. Negotiations are a good thing people.
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Originally Posted by DeadHead
(Post 674400)
No, actually I'm not flying anything for Continental.
Secondly, Colgan is flying routes that are, for the most part, less than 400nm and not cost effective with a jet. Expressjet on the other hand, is technically flying routes that belong to mainline. In the 90's your company grew at the expense of mainline jobs. I'm not making the above point to berate, but I am sure that the Continental Pilots sitting on the sidewalk, waiting for that callback to work, may feel that your company is staffing their position at a fraction of what their pay should be. |
The ignorance spewing from the same 'ol Colgan-hating blowhards is comical. We're making strides towards a better future for us, and the industry, and you ignoramuses can't see the forest from the trees. But for now, continue thinking your regional isn't part of the problem....regardless of what work rules you operate under. I have news for you.....ALL regionals ARE the problem....esp, the jet operators. Any growth at the regional level is at the expense of mainline routes, with a few exceptions.....surprise, those few are almost always turboprop routes....but you haters wouldn't be able to see that either.
Stay classy Colgan haters! |
Again......
I only counted four posts out of 55 pertaining to the subject at hand. The regional pilots once again maintain their high standards of posting, both Colgan and others. |
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