Furloughed & the ATP written
 

Read on another site that if your ATP written is over two years old and your furloughed from a 121 carrier, you can still take an ATP checkride.

The post stated that if you can prove to the FSDO that your still furloughed by your carrier, they take this as still "working" for them.

Any truth to this?

My written expires in December, I'm furloughed, and currently active duty with the National Guard leaving for a deployment in 2 weeks. Just trying to see if I need to push for a checkride before I leave. Don't wanna pay another $300 for another exam!

Thanks in advance guys!

Search the Comair thread, lots of information regarding an expiered ATP.

$300 for an exam? I think it was 'only' $100 when I took it in '07. I am also furloughed and my written has since expired...I can't remember the exact reg but if I remember correctly it's pretty clear that if you go to work for a 121/135/etc carrier, you can use the expired written for the check ride with the new company (may vary on the company rules themselves). I don't think you can use it if you go and take it part 91 by yourself though.

In my infinite boredom I dug up the reg, it's in 61.39(b), hope that helps

$300 when you go to ATP to take the written.

I retook the ATP written, since my previous time was Jan 2007, and I work for a foreign air carrier. I'm not sure the reg answers the question for military:

An applicant for an airline transport pilot certificate or an additional rating to an airline transport certificate may take the practical test for that certificate or rating with an expired knowledge test report, provided that the applicant:

(1) Is employed as a flight crewmember by a certificate holder under part 121, 125, or 135 of this chapter at the time of the practical test and has satisfactorily accomplished that operator's approved--

(i) Pilot in command aircraft qualification training program that is appropriate to the certificate and rating sought; and

(ii) Qualification training requirements appropriate to the certificate and rating sought; or

(2) Is employed as a flight crewmember in scheduled U.S. military air transport operations at the time of the practical test, and has accomplished the pilot in command aircraft qualification training program that is appropriate to the certificate and rating sought.

I'd say by going from what is on here as well as what I've heard from the past you can go ahead and save the 300 bucks...or buy 300 bucks in beer, but there is no need to waste it on another ATP written. The FARs say you can use an expired ATP written report for your ATP ride as long as your ATP ride takes place while you are working under 121 (and only if your ride is part of the 121 carriers training program so you can't do it on your own in a 172). It doesn't say that you have to be working for 121 carriers the "whole time it was expired" or anything like that. You can come back in 20 years and as long as a company will hire you without an "unexired ATP written" then you can still use the report you have in your hands now.

I got furloughed and used my expired written to take my ATP in a Seneca Pt.61 at my local school. It can be done, especially if you have a DPE that knows what he is doing.

I thought I read where a 121 carrier can get an expired ATP written unexpired. Therefore once taken, it's good forever if you gain employment with a 121 carrier.

The reg TW quoted says the knowledge test is expired but you can still use it. I don't think it ever un-expires. There are interpretations from the Chief Counsel's office that say a 121, 125 or 135 job gets you around where it says you have to have passed a written in 24 months but still call it expired.

If furloughed is employed is one thing, but how CRJdriver's DPE got around the operator's training program requirement is beyond me.

From the OoCC:

The section 61.39(b) exception allows the applicant to forego the requirements of section 61.39(a) indefinitely based on the expired knowledge test report.

This response was prepared by Viola Pando, an Attorney in the Regulations Division

Thanks for the reply guys!!

I'll get with my local DPE and see what he can do for me. Sounds to me like an "interpretation" issue with whoever is giving you a ride.

Speedbird: Yeah, it was 300 smackers at ALL ATP in ATL back in 2007.

Thanks again folks!

There seems to be a lot of confusion and different interpretations of the regulations regarding the ATP written. First, you ATP written expires after 24 calendar months. Period. It doesn't un-expire or anything! However, the regulations state: “Is employed as a flight crewmember by a certificate holder under part 121, 125, or 135 of this chapter at the time of the practical test.” The part that confused me and thought would make me ineligible is the “and has satisfactorily accomplished that operator's approved”, in this case when I would upgrade to Captain at my regional.

My ATP Written expired in March and I wanted to get my ATP in April, Pt. 61 at a local FBO. I did some research and talked to the DPE and called my local FSDO to confirm and see if I can use my expired written exam or if I would have to re-take it. After about a week of waiting and the FSDO confirming with OKC, I got the green light from the FSDO and my DPE and was told I was good to go, as long as I have a seniority number on file with my airline, I am still considered to be employed by a Pt. 121 carrier.

The issue you will run into is with IACRA. The system will reject your expired written exam. Luckily my DPE knew what he was doing and had dealt with this before. Instead of using IACRA, we completed a paper 8710, attached a copy of my furlough letter and my expired ATP written. It will definitely help if you have a DPE that knows what he is doing. I thoroughly researched this before I started my ATP and wanted confirmation from the FAA in OKC. So, it can be done if you have it all together, do some research and know what you are doing. I’ve heard some stories of regional FOs going to ALLATPs and trying to do this and got denied. I don’t know why? I really didn’t want to re-take that stupid test, as I though it was actually the hardest and most time consuming part of the whole process of getting the ATP. If you do have to re-take it or need to take the ATP written, I highly recommend the Sheppard Air program ($75). It is the same thing as the ATP program, but you won't pay $300 and you can study on your computer at your own pace.

You don't need to go to ATP. Just buy the latest Gleim ATP studyguide with CD and go over the test. It's not that hard if you take a couple of days to go over them thoroughly. I highly recommend everyone who meets the ATP requirements to get their ATPs now while they have the time. It will help you get your next job.

Wow, u can actually fly 121 without an ATP........... am sorry i just had to.

Yea you can because according to the regs FOs are just gear swingers for the PIC and can do their flying under their supervision. There's a whole 2 pages dedicated to sics in the FARs.

Use Sheppard air.. Blows All ATP away.

This means I can take my ATP practical, but is it like the airlines where you have to take the practical WITH the airlines with your expired written...bc im pretty sure the AF doesnt give out ATP's..... so I can go to a regular DE?