"Gust's don't matter for crosswind limit" ???
 

So were told in a memo recently issued, from our 9E management, that "Gust's don't matter for cross wind limit."

CRJ-200 X-Wind limit is 27 knots for a wet or dry runway
CRJ-200 X-Wind limit is 15 knots for a contaminated runway

Example:
Runway 36 Dry or Wet (Grooved rwy)
090/27G45....NEW interpretation is "within limits"
090/28.........NEW interpretation is "not within limits"

Runway 36 contaminated with 1 inch snow:
090/15G30....NEW interpretation is "within limits"
090/16.........NEW interpretation is "not within limits"

How unsafe!!!!!

That's easy. Just fly between the gusts!

Gusts only count as a limitation when you bend metal.:mad:

$imply the best, better than all the rest.

Trying to land that low winged/flat landing airplane with gusts 20 knots over its rated crosswind component? Well, I'm not surprised to see this from 9E of all places, apparently they have the impression that the feds have their back no matter what.

Safe, Legal, and Prudent....

Okay, 090/27G45 is Legal, but is it prudent or safe?

If the answer is NO, then don't take the flight.

And if you have been assigned a flight someone else refused, DON"T TAKE IT until conditions improve.

Would you takeoff under this condition with an FAA inspector on your jumpseat?

I guarantee it will matter to the NTSB. If the wind gust is over the limit, how can you ensure that there will be no gust when you're touching down? I would ignore that memo if your certificate is valuable to you.

I don't even see how you can argue that it is legal.

you are the pilot in command, not a sheet of paper, if you feel its safe, do it, if not simply say, I am waiting till the wind dies down to where i feel comfortable. If they want the flight to go then, they will find someone else. You are flying the plane and passengers are counting on you to make the right decision.

You bring up a good question. Who do you underwrite?

To be clear. I was being a little sarcastic and tongue in cheek. I would take off if there was an alternative runway at the destination that would bring the crosswind within limits or if we had an alternate airport that met the limits.



Except for emergencies and abnormal situations I will not land outside of limitations. I have done crosswinds beyond the limit before it was a limitation. Most worked out fine. One got a little sporting. The wing dropped so fast in the flare I used full deflection momentarily to bring it up. Landed just fine but after that I was fine seeing the crosswind limit. I include the gusts.

Wow. Not playing the "my airline is better than yours" game, but we have a 3rd X-wind limitation at XJ. It's 27 for dry, 22 for wet and 15 for slippery. These limits are further restrictive if you have less than 100 hours in the plane. It also is so very clear in black and white that we MUST consider gusts as apart of the limitations.

It never ceases to amaze me that your mgmt still thinks you're a bunch of idiots, when perhaps they're ought to look at themselves in the face. How your POI lets your mgmt do some of the stuff they do is incredible. More proof that the operator and FAA are often in bed with each other.

They have to be with some of the things that have gone on here in the past, I will say though the training and operation have gotten a ton better than 5 years ago. Knock on wood.

Not sure how your company is run, but since when does a company memo superceed an FAA approved publication like your AOM and the limitations it provides?

I ain't never been no good at spellin them big wordz.

Spelling errors have been fixed for cencal.

Mason, anytime a Pinnacle manager signs his initials to anything he thinks it overrides the feds, whether it be FAA, FMLA, MIL leave etc.

Thanks man! Now back to the INSANITY of calling a gust factor not part of the limitation....

I'll do it, suit up.

I am actually really impressed that everyone who has responded to this on the company board has said they will still be using the gust factor. I for one would never risk this one.

On another note, one of our guys talked to the local FSDO within an hour of the memo going out. They are looking into it and will get back to him.

Its ok as long as the A/P is operative.

Just a thought but maybe the "gust limit" memo was for dispatchability? At my former airline prior to my furlough airline the gusts were also not considered however at my furloughed airline they were considered.

Is that airline TRYING to have another accident?

They seem to be doing everything they can to point themselves in that direction...

The limitations at my airline are very similar, and have been for as long as I have been here. We don't factor in gust factors as far as a limitation goes, but that's not to say we won't take it into consideration. Bottom line, if you're not comfortable doing it, then don't.

Just tried to land a 200 on a contaminated rwy with
xwind at 17kts G26. Mu's were at 40. Then a 121 carrier reports ba poor. We go missed because we can't land (sop) with ba reports of poor and xwind greater than 10kts. We Held while 7 crews in a row from every airline landed and reported it poor as well. Couldn't believe it. It was an Ils to about 1sm.

Screw memos. Also, your apostrophe usage is flawed. "Gust's"?

SOP is the Captain lands above 20kt crosswinds...but in practice if the other guy can hold his own, he'll usually do it.

Tell that to Continental...

There is no dry runway x wind limit on the CRJ series. ..only company mandated limits. SKYW routinely lands them in +30 (they have NO LIMIT AT ALL on dry runway Xwind) and I suspect everyone else does too.

At Mesaba all our x-wind limitations are more restrictive than the manufacturer, except the 10 knot tailwind limit.
27 dry, 22 wet and 15 slippery. The dry is even further reduced if you have less than 100 hrs on the plane to 20 Ca and 15 Fo. These are hard limitations, not demonstrated.

This sounds .. false?

It's true. The aircraft comes from the factory with a max demonstrated crosswind number, but it is not a limitation - you can go beyond that number, but you become a test pilot. Most airlines impose the limitation.

At the company I work for x-wind limits are all based on the steady state wind(says it right in the FSM under the x-wind limits)...been that way for at least the last 5 years.

It lists them by braking action,
good braking 27, fair 15, poor 10

Same for us at XJT on the EMB-145. There is no crosswind limitation. Only a max demonstrated crosswind of 30 kts. Needs to be that way fling in and out of EWR where 30 kts is standard.