Interesting letter from Roger Cohen I found
 

Take a read as Roger Cohen pathetically tries to defend the position of the RAA to a travel magazine editor

http://www.raa.org/Portals/0/News/CondeNast120109.pdf

The RAA is doing a study with washington state university for fatigue on regional pilots...GREAT. But, the RAA likes to use averages, I can see them using the best regional contract for rest rules and flight limits, use the average of those times, and find out that the "average" regional pilot is only flying 4 hours a day, on duty 10 hrs, and gets 14 hours of rest, therefore no change is needed.

Any chance for a link back to the Conde Nast article?

While what Cohen may state in this letter is factually correct, it is but a rebuttal and as such paints a very incomplete picture.

You are right, nothing he said in that letter was a lie. But I do hate that they say safety is number one to the company. The first thing to any for-profit company is making money for the company and the shareholders. If it isn't, the company has failed. Ethically the first priority should be safety, and I think it is to most pilots. Now if you can market yourself as the safest airline in the world, where people buy your tickets because of extra safety measures, and that offsets the cost of safety, then you have a great airline.

What's interesting is that, in my native language, the words "Roger Cohen" mean an unwiped anal orifice. Funny how these things happen, eh?

Cohen's testimony to Congress on Colgen is a travesty of lies and half truths. There is no coicidence between his name and what it means where I come from.

I too would like to see the original article.

Conde Nast had voted Midwest Express/Midwest as the best domestic carrier for years. Maybe they were just sad to see the all-first-class seats and "best care in the air" go away.

I have always been told when you have nothing good to say, don't say anything. And I have NOTHING good to say about that *&%*%&%^$& Roger Cohen.

Downsized! The Rise of Regional Airlines from Condé Nast Traveler on Concierge.com

What's the difference between Roger Cohen and a catfish? One is a scum-sucking bottom feeder and the other is fish.

I think in the spirit of this we should start a campaign to replace labels such as SNAFU, FUBAR, TU and JACKED UP with a more universal title called Roger Cohen'd or simply something is Romeo Charlie.

ATC: "state the nature of the problem?"
Flt1234 "We are declaring an emergency as our #2 engine is completely Romeo Charlie"
ATC: "Roger, rollin trucks....."

I laughed so hard at that I think I may have woken up my wife who is sleeping upstairs!

But more seriously, as good as this article is, the flying public is not being held accountable for their own actions in my opinion.

If the public continues to base purchasing decisions based on dirt cheap prices and not based on safety and quality, the results are predictable. I think a lot of these articles and TV specials need to emphasize that the consumers themselves are driving the industry.

Not entirely their fault, there are not any product labels or warnings required.

Airline tickets should be labeled like food for safety risk, relative to the airline industry as a whole with special warnings for certain categories...



Bottom-feeder Airlines Flight 3707:
Flight Crew Pay: 9% percentile
Flight Crew Experience level: 6% percentile
Flight Crew Saturated Experience Level: 3% percentile (operational experience acquired outside of formal training programs)
Flight Crew Rest Rules: 4% percentile
Cabin Crew Pay: 8% Percentile
Maintenance Budget (pro rata): 2% percentile
Ten Year Incident/Accident Rate (industry normalized): 1,790%

WARNING: This airline employs flight crew members with no prior commercial pilot experience.

WARNING: This airline employs fight crew members who do not hold an Airline Transport Pilot License.

WARNING: This airline utilizes Flight Crew rest rules which do not meet the NTSB recommended minimum daily rest allowance.

WARNING: This airline has been found in violation of FAA maintenance requirements within the previous five years.

WARNING: This airline's historical accident is significantly higher than industry average. This historical travel risk corresponds approximately to:

[ ] Staying home in your basement bomb shelter
[ ] Normal Airline Travel
[ ] Taking the Train
[ ] Cross country travel in a large automobile
[ ] Cross country travel in a small private airplane
[ ] Landing a Fighter Jet on an Aircraft Carrier, at night, in storm conditions.
[X] Cross country travel on a motorcycle, in winter storm conditions
[ ] Travel to the International Space Station

I know, and I agree with what you are saying. I don't want to level too hefty an accusation at the consumer when there are so many other links in the chain here. But I think on some level this should be brought to their collective attention.

That'd be nice, but unless some national-sized organization such as ALPA decides to take a stand on issues like this, the corporations will do the same to the airline industry that they did to the U.S.A. textile industry.

Remember when the last Levi Strauss closed it's last U.S. based factory and outsourced overseas? The same thing is happening to us. It's not just the airlines either, it's every job of value which can be done by someone else more cheaply in a Third World Country. Next up; cabotage.

BTW, telling the pilots of a start-up "bottom-feeder" airline to hold the line against corporate greed while the legacies are back-pedaling to the 1960s is worse than hypocritical. It is useless finger-pointing which puts the blame on the wrong party. I don't fault the Colgan pilots for the actions of their company. Although those pilots in the industry who have more experience in both flying and unionism could have helped mitigate these issues if they'd chosen to work together on the problem, the main problem is much larger than the airline industry. The power money has on almost everything in our nation overtakes many of our traditional values as America citizens and it has overtaken certain aspects of airline safety.

The many statements by Mr. Cohen poo-pooing safety concerns voiced by ALPA such as fatigue, low pay, scheduling and so forth are the perfect example of what I am writing about.

But more seriously, as good as this article is, the flying public is not being held accountable for their own actions in my opinion.

If the public continues to base purchasing decisions based on dirt cheap prices and not based on safety and quality, the results are predictable. I think a lot of these articles and TV specials need to emphasize that the consumers themselves are driving the industry.


Excellent point, and very true.

Can't be ruled out entirely but there are some significant hurdles which will not be overcome anytime soon...

1. Labor and their associated politicians will not sit still for this. It simply could not happen in the current political environment.

2. Public Perception. This is weak but #1 will play up #3 and #4, and probably get the general public to oppose cabotage.

3. National Security.

4. Safety. This could be a real concern...if they are cheap enough to undercut us in our own domain, they might not have exemplary safety standards.

I suspect that we will not see true domestic cabotage, but eventually all international flying will done under code-share by the lowest-cost airlines...this will be bad for US and European crews.

Well there's a big difference between colgan and the majors...the majors at least still pay a living wage that you can support a family on, maybe not in style, but at least vital needs and basic amenities. Also their regular workdays are not as abuse-filled as bottom-feeder regional pilots.

Entry-level pilots need to realize that regionals are no longer a place to pay dues...dues paid at a regional will not get you anything anymore! Maybe a job at a major, commuting to reserve making what an average accountant can pull down. But not everyone will even get that far....

Agreed about the hurdles, but I suspect we'll see cabotage sooner rather than later, especially if the the pro-business party regains the White House and Congress.

While you make many good points, a few comments on them:
1. The pro-labor politicians are not as strong nor as prevalent as needed in order to stop a move by global corporations towards cabotage.

2. The Public wants to fly First Class in a 777 from Tupelo to Peoria direct for $99 and a free hotel night coupon. What they want and what they will settle for on Orbitz are two different things.

3. If it came down to it, I could see the US government subsidizing a national airline (singular) for national security reasons but that day is a long way away, if ever arriving. There are plenty of airlines in the USA for government contracting. It would take more than a couple of them going Tango Uniform before any government officials would bat an eye about national security concerns.

4. Americans want price first. Sure, safety standards will be applied just like they are to Mexican 18-wheelers northbound on I-35 under NAFTA. http://www.piratesonlineforums.com/f...ptain.wink.gif

Agreed on this likelihood. However, the lessons of whipsawing and "competitive" pricing shouldn't be lost on any union pilot. All it takes is one or two foreign carriers flitting through the USA under modern cabotage rules to put pressure on the domestic pilot livelihood.


You are missing my point. First, by referring to them as "bottom-feeder" pilots the "Us" and "Them" attitude continues. This attitude works in management's favor, not ours.

The days of major airline pilots looking down their noses at FLAPs has resulted in what we see presently in our industry.

The real culprit here is the Airline Deregulation Act. If pilots don't hang together, then, like Ben Franklin said, "we shall most assuredly hang separately."

Pilots blaming pilots have done nothing except waste time and making a few pilots feel better about themselves. Meanwhile, it's management raking in the bonuses and its pilots who are taking the hits in pay, benefits and quality of life.

Oh, yeah I forgot the CRAF (Civil Reserve Air Fleet). A large percentage of US airliners are actually "Military Reservists"...they can be activated by the DoD to carry personnel and supplies in support of major contingency operations. When that happens they are operated normally by their company and it's pilots, but the schedules, destinations, and manifests are dictated by the DoD (which pays for it of course).

I think 1300-1400 airliners are part of this program, mostly heavies...probably ALL of the heavies in US airline service. If those went away due to cabotage the USAF would have to buy something like 800 C-5's and 500 C-17's :eek: :eek: :eek:

Deregulation is long gone, under the bridge, down the river, and out to sea...that water is halfway to antartica by now! Why waste your breath on that?

I am not trying to bash or make anyone feel bad for the sake of feeling bad. We all have to wake up to the new reality...career regional pilots (most of them) need to make their companies a comfortable, if not lucrative, place to hang out. Some folks may benefit from a little enlightenment...if other companies can avoid abusing their employees, why can't they all?

If you seriously think the effects of deregulation are over and done with, then what do you attribute to the continued rise of low cost airlines and, what you term, "bottom feeders"? How could they even have existed prior to 1978? Air Transportation: Deregulation and Its Consequences

Agreed here. They need to drop the idea of regional airlines being mere stepping stones to "the majors". The majors are mere shells of what they once were in terms of pilot pay and benefits not to mention financial solvency.

They need to realize that they are in competition with some outdated ideas by legacy pilots about the future of domestic airlines in the USA and where they are most likely to spend the rest of their careers.

As for those same legacy pilots, they have a choice; continue seeing and treating the regional pilots as the enemy or seek to forge a strong and fair bond with them in order to exert as much control over their own careers as possible.

No my point was that that we can't DO anything about it, because regulation is not coming back no matter how much we whine...better to spend your energy on other avenues. Regulation will only return in the event a true economic/industry catastrophe, following the Ch.7 liquidation of more than one legacy.

No doubt, they are sowing the seeds of their own destruction. Unfortunately, the senior leaders who only need to milk another ten or fewer years out of the system have no incentive to take a long term view. TODAY the RJ pilots subsidize a higher hourly rate for them. Tomorrow...who even cares about tomorrow, they'll be over the age of 65.

The modern airline industry will consist of large, low cost midsized airliners flown by the former regionals and severely downsized major airlines reinventing themselves as primarily international and major hub-to-major hub airlines.

There was one lie, or maybe its a misconception: that regional service cannot be provided by major airline pilots.

Agreed on both counts. My point was the industry is still evolving due to deregulation. 9/11 didn't change our industry as much as accelerate what was already in progress.

True, unfortunately their younger and less experienced brethren are just as clueless and as caring about the future.

This has been tried before...so far the attempts have never come close to success, they have ended on liquidation. Not saying it couldn't happen but it's not as easy as it sounds. There are many, many other factors other than pilot wages...the savings realized on $20K FO's cannot maker up for all of the other hurdles.