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XJT Pilot Stands Up to TSA

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XJT Pilot Stands Up to TSA

Old 10-18-2010, 04:47 PM
  #31  
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As for the "victim" in this story, he asked for it by running his mouth. When he asked if he was under arrest and their response was anything other than saying "yes", reading him his rights, and cuffing him, he should have turned and left. But Mr Big Shot had to try to prove a point to some mindless government bureaucrats. Yeah, good move, how'd that work out for ya?
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Old 10-18-2010, 04:56 PM
  #32  
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Tony, i got to agree. Like i said, could have been dealt with so much better. I again, hope the job can be kept. Seems like this is the guy that says I save hundreds of lives a week, and fly a 40 ton airplane at 35000 feet at your local party. Didnt work out well
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Old 10-18-2010, 04:58 PM
  #33  
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I admire him for standing up for what he believes. I, on the other hand, have bigger fish to fry than getting in a pi$$ing match with the TSA. It's like arguing with a 3rd grader about what color is the best. I would have went through through the screener and showed them the "helicopter".
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Old 10-18-2010, 05:05 PM
  #34  
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Cool So Brave or So Stupid

Originally Posted by TurboFan View Post
Although I have my issues with the ACLU, if I were this pilot, I would be contacting them immediately. They'd have this on CNN and other news networks by tomorrow morning. I couldn't agree more that things are being taken to an extreme level in regards to airport security these days. I as well have refused a AIT scan, however instead of receiving an immediate pat down, I had to wait 3-4 minutes.

Good luck on your fight brother! We should all be so brave.
What is the ACLU going to do for this pilot ? Federal law is exactly that and while we all despise going through security screening as professional pilots, let's not loose sight of the fact that impostors have gotten through screening before and boarded flights; those who aren't pilots have purchased uniforms and were able to get into the sterile areas of Cat X airports and it doesn't take a genius to figure out what other consequences can come out of abandoning the current protocols.

Do we need CrewPass ? Absolutely. Good ol' ALPA was pushing for it and almost had FAA approval during the mid 1990's (1993 to be exact) until it became a political "issue". Until the federal authorities wake up and common sense prevails, we have to live with the current system...like it or not.

BTW, was this pilot "brave" in challenging the TSA ? I think not. If you prefer not to go through AIT screening, fine. Then accept a pat down, be professional and get on with it. He wasn't brave, he was stupid. Know when to pick your battles.

G'Luck Mates
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Old 10-18-2010, 05:10 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by Captain Tony View Post
The quote is: "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."- Benjamin Franklin

If you don't know it, don't make stuff up just to sound cool.
Who cares? The meaning of the quote came across just fine. What are you trying to do with your anal and meaningless nit picking? "Sound cool"? I bet you're fun to fly with!

Lighten up Francis.
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Old 10-18-2010, 05:13 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by JoeyMeatballs View Post
What drives me completely nuts is how the Rampers can bypass security.
I worked as a ramper for about a month at a major airport, arriving at work I only had to swipe my card, type in my pin, open the door and walk 25 yards and be on the tarmac without absolutely nobody watching me. I was able to do this day one of employment.

Where's the logic here??
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Old 10-18-2010, 05:27 PM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by Flex81 View Post
I admire him for standing up for what he believes. I, on the other hand, have bigger fish to fry than getting in a pi$$ing match with the TSA. It's like arguing with a 3rd grader about what color is the best. I would have went through through the screener and showed them the "helicopter".
Amazing!!! "helicopter" I just **** myself laughing. TSA is a joke and I'm on the pilots side for sure.
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Old 10-18-2010, 05:36 PM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by BYUFlyr View Post
Really? Are we still battling this issue as professional flight crews? Do these morons know that we are the ones in control of the aircraft and crash ax which sits behind our seat? I wonder if members of Congress get frisked before entering federal buildings or boarding their private tax-funded airplanes... it would make just as much sense. I applaud him for standing up for his rights, though I think I would've just demanded a private room and then immediately made every effort to expose this upside-down logic to the press. I hope ALPA gets all over this like white on rice (at a slightly hastier pace than CREWPASS).
The correct answer to the question is "YES".

In the 1992, Congress appropriated $2 million dollars for a feasibility study of a flight crew pass system; then called "TWIC". The study was done at CLT, DTW and MIA and the carriers that participated were Delta, Northwest and U.S. Airways. In the 90 days of the test, participating crewmembers went through a portal, swiped their dual biometric ID cards and underwent a quick fingerprint verification. The system worked and the FAA was impressed with the possibilities. As the approval process was nearing, it became a political football and Congress once again got involved and decided we needed "more tests". The TWIC (CrewPass) access program died a natural death. The irony was that the cost of readers and dual biometric ID cards came to about $12 per flight crewmember. There was an economy of scale and if flight attendants and ramp personnel were added, the cost per card dropped to under $10 a piece. We had over 500 pilots who volunteered to pay $25 out of their own pocket to participate. Just think, it could have become a profit center for the FAA.

Forget the TSA. They have nothing to do with policy implementation of this nature. It has to come from Congress as a directive to the FAA and then TSA to implement. Until we, as a group of professional pilots, demand that Congress acts, we going to continue to stand in line with Joe and Jane Public. Folks, it's that simple !

G'Luck Mates
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Old 10-18-2010, 06:04 PM
  #39  
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Just so we know what we’re up against here folks:

For passengers in airports with the new full body scanners, the now preferred method of screening is going through the body scanner (go to the TSA site or do and image search to see what images they can see look like. Backscatter x-rays produce particularly accurate and graphic images of the male genitals. Females fare slightly better, though you can still make out a good deal of their shape. Millimeter-wave scans don’t appear to as invasive for either sex.) They can opt out, but if they choose to do that they will be subject to “secondary screening.” This consists of a very through search of their carry-on bags (including swabbing for explosives, apparently) as well as a pat down.
To add fuel to the fire, the TSA is converting to “enhanced pat downs” on October 31. They won’t give many specifics as to what this entails, but its been in a “test” phase in BOS and LAS over the last few months. (A search for “enhanced pat downs” will give you some info on what’s going on.) The folks who have been through the experience haven’t had much good to say about it. Even the mild examples have been very thorough. They use the front of their hand and palm vs. the back of their hand, and apparently will feel the underside and between women’s breasts, as well as (both sexes) buttocks. There have been reports that screeners have poked, prodded, and/or groped peoples crotches and/or genitals. Its not certain if this is part of the SOP now, or if the screener was conducting the screening incorrectly or abusively.

As per usual with the TSA, the treatment of crews seems to be varying widely from airport to airport. Some still don’t have the technology, you can avoid it by going to a different lane, or we bypass security altogether. Other airports we don’t appear to be required to utilize it. Still others if we opt out they don’t care. And yet others they are forcing crews to be scanned or opt out to secondary screening - and a few of course are being rude and/or abusive. This seems to be happening to both commuters and on-duty crews (from what I’ve gathered - please correct me if I’m wrong.)

Personally, I don’t believe this is an appropriate level of privacy for passengers or crew, and I don’t particularly want to have to choose between having my private parts either viewed or groped by a “light” criminal with a GED - just so I can go to work.

All I can say is be polite, be professional, but don’t tolerate any abusive behavior. Document, Document, Document the names and facts, and if anything questionable or abusive happens, contact supervisors, LEO’s, Reps, and Chief pilots as appropriate.

You can also send the facts to EPIC (Electronic Privacy Information Center,) as they have filed suit against the DHS for scanners violating 4th amendment rights, as well as several federal laws. You can also send the info to the ACLU, as they are another organization collecting information on how theses machines are being used, and potentially abused.
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Old 10-18-2010, 09:03 PM
  #40  
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The worst part is...those million dollar machines don't work! There was an assassination attempt on the head of Saudi Arabia anti terrorism and the suicide bomber passed throughone of these porn machines along with other devices and still managed to get thru.

TSA has a tough job, agreed, but they focus onthe wrong things. It's just more "security theater".

Remember to demand a private screening are if you get frisked.
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