Does per diem pretty much cover taxes?
 

I was told by an airline buddy to consider an airlines monthly reserve, at your pay rate, to be close to what you'll actually take home. He said that the per diem about covers taxes, for planning purposes. Would you all agree to that?

(Yes, I know some people say don't count it is income, but I'd like to be able to plan what a realistic check would look like)

Per diem covers food you need to eat while at work.

Take your guarentee and subtract 30% for taxes medical insurance, ect... that will put you close to what you should bring home in a relatively conservative fashion. Don't count on time over guarentee or per diem as they are not consistent.

If you find yourself sitting reserve in base while being a commuter and don't fly you don't get per diem but still have to eat and pay for a crash pad. :eek:

Yes, I would say that is pretty realistic. But it is difficult to know if you will be used on reserve or not... For November I only have worked 40 hours, which really hurts the per diem, so for this month, no it probably wont cover my taxes. But generally, I would say you could assume that.

As a lineholder its nice but not great. But when I sat reserve there were some months I didn't get more than 50 bucks per diem.
I would say on average I get 450-600 bucks a month in per diem.
Hope that helps.

You can come out way ahead on per diem if you are smart and do a little planning. 90% of the time you get free breakfast at hotel. Lunch can usually be free via something you grabbed from breakfast or out of the flight snack basket or pack a few PB&J's for your trip so I rarely paid for lunch either. I will splurge for a nice dinner if the layover permits and I almost always have $200 leftover per diem each month.

Delta1067... this is not a rip on you, just on our profession's situation in general.

Isn't it sad that we, as professional airline pilots, consider eating a free, unhealthy, and unreliable breakfast... and possibly saving enough for lunch (using PB&Js as a backup) to be "coming out way ahead".

There are so many things in this industry trying to destroy your health.... try not to let the cost of healthy food make nutrition another factor to that list.

I second that. It's also amazing to me how many pilots just sit in their rooms the entire overnight. I'm fortunate enough to stay downtown at most long layovers. I take advantage of this and treat layovers like a vacation. Isn't traveling what this job is all about?

No prob..I didn't take that as a rip. I wasn't too clear so my bad. I am a very healthy person and can usually find healty choices at free hotel breakfasts such as yougart, fruit, cereal. I will skip it before I eat dounuts and muffins and unhealthy carbs/sugars. My point was more on saving money but you can do that while eating healthy as well. I will spend money on healthy food before I eat junk for free if that is my only choice. I too treat layovers like a vacation and will always go out and enjoy what the cities have to offer. I'm just saying it isn't hard to come out ahead on per diem and do it healthy while enjoying your layovers as well.

Thanks guys, appreciate the input!

It also depends on the company. They all have different per diem rates.

PaycheckCity.com | Web-Based Paycheck Calculators

Try that site out to figure out your take home pay.

per diem is not income! So don't plan on getting it.

Sorry, but that's just not realistic. I understand that the amount varies (especially on reserve), which is why I asked for a general idea. Although it's not taxable income, it's still money coming in which I can use in my budgeting. And for determining whether I should make a job change or not, it must to be included in my considerations.

My perdiem at my current job more than covers my student loan payments... that's hardly insignificant.

Thanks for the link, though, that's a nice site!

Actually.......
Forget it. Not worth my time to educate you. Some day you'll figure it out, and I'll say I told you so. :D

I get the point you're trying to make... And I appreciate your time. But I know that per-diem doesn't equal zero, so the most realistic thing I can do is ask for averages and rules of thumb. :D

Per diem is income. Although not w-2 iincome, it is tax free money coming into my pocket. To me that = income. Furthermore, it meets the basic definition of "income". Last year I made $4,600 in per diem tax free. For me to net $4,600 I would have had to have grossed approx $7,000. PLUS, when I itimized my per per diem on my tax return I got me an extra $900 on my refund. So my "realized" income when it comes to per diem is the same as had I made an extra $7,900 of 2-w earnings. The beauty is is that it is all tax free. I come out way ahead on mine and so will you unless you really spend/plan foolishly.

Tax free money to replace the money you've spent; that you would not have spent if you would have been at home.

I bet you eat Taco Bell, Wendy's, and all that other $6 meal cheap processed crap food. Gonna make it to 65? :D

And you probably are a 'slam clicker'. :cool:

Right, tax free money to replace what you spent and the entire point of the topic was you don't have to spend it all and you can still eat healthy and go out and have fun on layovers. I eat very healthy and will only do fast/junk food as a very last resort, rarely happens but when it does even fast food has healty choices. Again, healthy breakfast is almost always free and I never have problems getting by cheap/healthy for lunch. I splurge on layovers and enjoy myself and still come out way ahead. Sorry you can't do the same.

Will I make it to 65? I hope not! I'm on pace to have the option to retire before I'm 60. If I am still enjoying it I will keep on flying. I'll let ya know in 31 years if I make it to 65. Life is good :D

good point. i don't eat when i'm at home. i spend no money when i'm at home. i hadn't thought this through...i might just give up this career as an airline pilot, and get a regular job where i'm at home instead of traveling, because i spend no money that way! wow.

So let me get this straight- if you DON'T spend EVERY dollar of your per-diem while on the road, you're an unhealthy slam-clicker? I think I understand your logic now, of course it's not income if you live like Bernie Madoff on your layovers...

Myself, I plan to exercise some self control (don't have much of a choice), and I have had a good time on the majority of my layovers.

$6 cheap processed crap food? Try two burgers at Burger King (Whopper Jrs.) for right around $3. Foot long dog at Interstate right around $3.50. Piece of pizza at Sabaros under $4. Who spends 6 bucks on airport food?

Thank you Captain America. Very intelligent.. Keep relying on your per diem as income...

LOL. You would think so according to his logic. He must live somewhere the grocerie stores and resturants give away free food. He probably also thinks that all his friends in other professions get to eat for free while airline pilots are the only ones forced to buy a meal while at work. All my doctor, lawyer, teacher, engineer, blue collar, you name it, friends have to pay for their meal while at work and they don't get per diem. I'm glad I don't live life with his logig & outlook.

Lol. Wow. You guys win. Per diem is income. I'm going to use it for budgeting. Good call. Now thats what i call Good financial management.

As opposed to your genius financial management skills where you unnecessarily fail to take advantage of the fact that you can come out way ahead on per diem and put it to use in other areas of your household budget.

I think you are confusing the issue here. No one is saying that per diem should replace income and that seems to be the conclusion that you assume we are jumping to. Per diem should never replace income but when per diem rates allow us to come out ahead than there is nothing wrong with that extra money being used for other purpose such as paying off student loans or an Xmas/Vacation fund.

I'm just trying to advise the original poster not to plan his budget counting on getting per diem.

Regional's per diem rates are about 50 cents per hour less than mainline, so at the end of the year that makes quite a big difference.

I can go a whole month spending 10 bucks for a few reasons. One of the reasons is I am cheap...just because it costs me $20 at a nice restaurant downtown does not mean it is a superior meal. The other reason is I like having food I want and when I want it because there are times its not acceptable for me to duty off at 0200 and find a meal.

My wife (amazing woman) will make many meals for me in advance such as lasagna or meatloaf or pasta or anything else that keeps well. It then goes into a vacuum sealed bag and gets frozen. I bring enough for lunch and dinner for a four day and every night put it in the hotel fridge or on ice. This allows me to have something that is relatively good for me and if the day is falling apart I can heat something up in ops on a turn instead of settling for MCd's or other airport junk or just skipping a meal all together.

Of course the vacuum sealer costs money as well as the food that is prepared but it is probably $30 for the month in prepared food. I usually spend less than $5 a week on food since I have my own and the rest goes in the bank.

I do not depend on per diem or count it as income but it is not spent on food and it goes into the bank.

As for going out on an overnight, I will on occasion. This is my job and my life is at home. I would much rather get to the hotel and take care of some things and then workout a bit and then there is only a few hours left before bed anyway since most overnights are short. I would much rather not go out and save the $30 on dinner and drinks and then put it towards going out with my wife and friends and family when I get home.

I did not take this job so others can think I am fun to hang out with on overnights by going out to dinner and a bar. If you want to have fun, go for a run with me and see some of the surrounding area.

Blood pressure and cholesterol 30 bucks a month.

Me personally, I try to save my per diem. I pack a lunch box and can eat out of that for 3 or 4 days, I started this due to health reasons mainly and I managed to lose a significant amount of weight by not eating at the airport. That said now if I feel like getting a cup of chili or something different, I will go ahead an pony up the money for it. I'll go out with the crew to dinner or buy a meal maybe once a trip on the overnight if we are staying someplace enjoyable.

I don't count on it as income but I will take any additional money I can get since I'm back on first year pay.

keep being completely unable (or unwilling) to see what the guy is talking about...and me too, for that matter. not one single person has said to "rely" on per diem as income. you have some militant aversion to even thinking about per diem as money at all.

obviously you've never had a real job, like in an office. you get up in the morning, you go to work. you work all day. you go home. you spend the night in your house. any food you eat, any stuff you do, any things you pay for during the day and at night, is money out of your pocket that is not given back to you by your employer in any way, shape, or form. (let's not get into expense accounts, etc.)

whereas in our jobs, when we're gone to work, we do all those things, except we stay in hotels at night. we get per diem. it can be used to pay for food, etc. it doesn't have to be. it shouldn't be assumed to always be constant. if you can live without it, then it's like a savings plan...you're much better off. but to just militantly act like it doesn't exist...to ignore the guy's questions and intent...it's just silly. stop letting everything have to conform to your worldview.

This is dead on! Exactly how I think about it! (just wish the fiance could cook!)

Ding, ding, ding! Thank you...somebody gets it!