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-   -   Comair to be shut down 9/29 (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/regional/69160-comair-shut-down-9-29-a.html)

Dirt Doctor 07-29-2012 07:21 PM

Delta pilots want the flying. Give it to them all at once. I hope you all use your sick time on the same days. Might as well cost Delta as much money as you can before you leave. I have been out sick since November! They may win the war, but we should inflict as much damage as possible before its over.

gojo 07-29-2012 07:55 PM


Originally Posted by FIIGMO (Post 1237060)
I am not sure what you want someone to say. Your anger being out of a job I totally get and can sympathize. However, I am not sure if you are being affected in a direct way. RJ contracts are just that, If RA and your CEO agree that it is financially better to proceed with a certain business plan I am sure your or my input is not a factor. Therefore, why blame DAL pilots. DAL pilots are protecting our jobs as best we can. I am hopeful it RJ flying will be further reduce and look forward to it as fast as possible. Participate if you wish but be sure you look at this situation from an objective professional view point. Mainly, we have no control over what management does. So don;t blame pilots like mushmouth did.:mad:

Ya i'm angry. You say it's business, I say it's greed. Whatever it is, it didn't need to be done like this. Delta made huge profits the last two quarters, and didn't have to rush into shutting Comair down. Lets not forget that Comair was opperating less than 20 of these inefficient CRJ 200's. A drop in the bucket compared to others. Why the rush? Why not wait until they started hiring again, and then do it. I'll use the word integrity again, and ask how RA or Delta shows it to others. Just business, whatever. The mob used to say that too. Now it's just legalized. Our laws allow a company to purposley poster themselves into bankruptcy. Or purposely drive one of their contracters into bankruptcy by not paying them. Buy them up after they devalue them. It should be illeagle. But they get away with it. Why? Because they have deeper pockets. When did we as pilots or human beings become so self serving? You say, we can't control what management does, and you are correct. But they sure as heck don't need a cheerleading section when they behave this way. Speak up if you don't like something. If enough people do, they will hear you. I just wasted 20 minutes of my night, rant over

Bucking Bar 07-30-2012 05:09 AM

Gojo,

What you write resonates. Delta states Comair is "uncompetitive" and has "high costs." Why wont anyone ask the logical question ... "Well, who managed Comair?"

Comair's costs are a direct result of:
(1) Scheduling inefficiencies as 9 carriers over fly one another across the same network carrying the same passengers.
(2) Fleet utilization inefficiencies (see above)
(3) Fleet age ... Delta outsourced new equipment to other providers
(4) Employee Longevity ... Comair has no low scale employees because as Delta shrank them, Comair became more senior.

Any Delta employee who does not understand these same people are managing Delta the same way don't understand this business. Delta mainline's costs are increasing as flying is performed by SkyTeam "partners." By my count there are 10 separate aircraft types & certificates serving just KLGA. If every square inch of the airport was used to house maintenance spares and house crews, there would not be sufficient room. Anything from a minor mechanical to a cloud over Washington Center is going to just destroy operational reliability in New York.

As our "partners" grow with new crews and new equipment Delta's costs will escalate in comparison. In fact, we already hear management stating this clearly in our quarterly investors' calls. (I think the number was 4% increase in costs due to capacity reductions ... but I've been up all night)

As employees there is nothing we can do in the face of management outsourcing except unity. This is where mainline pilots every where have let you, me, and this profession down. There should have been no Comair growth at Delta's expense. There should be no GoJets growth at Comair's expense. We should be in this together.

Every pilot will have to decide for themselves what course of action is best. I'm sure Delta will keep Comair's employment / payroll records and use them during interviews. Probably best to grit your teeth, fly safe, show up and do the work you get paid for. If I were doing the hiring seeing someone work through the most adverse circumstances imaginable would be a huge credit to the applicant's integrity.

crewdawg 07-30-2012 05:42 AM


Originally Posted by Dirt Doctor (Post 1237199)
Delta pilots want the flying. Give it to them all at once. I hope you all use your sick time on the same days. Might as well cost Delta as much money as you can before you leave. I have been out sick since November! They may win the war, but we should inflict as much damage as possible before its over.

WOW! Ya, and then maybe your Dad can go beat up their Dad too...:rolleyes:

dmbmarkt 07-30-2012 06:11 AM


Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 1237287)
Gojo,

What you write resonates. Delta states Comair is "uncompetitive" and has "high costs." Why wont anyone ask the logical question ... "Well, who managed Comair?"

Comair's costs are a direct result of:
(1) Scheduling inefficiencies as 9 carriers over fly one another across the same network carrying the same passengers.
(2) Fleet utilization inefficiencies (see above)
(3) Fleet age ... Delta outsourced new equipment to other providers
(4) Employee Longevity ... Comair has no low scale employees because as Delta shrank them, Comair became more senior.

Any Delta employee who does not understand these same people are managing Delta the same way don't understand this business. Delta mainline's costs are increasing as flying is performed by SkyTeam "partners." By my count there are 10 separate aircraft types & certificates serving just KLGA. If every square inch of the airport was used to house maintenance spares and house crews, there would not be sufficient room. Anything from a minor mechanical to a cloud over Washington Center is going to just destroy operational reliability in New York.

As our "partners" grow with new crews and new equipment Delta's costs will escalate in comparison. In fact, we already hear management stating this clearly in our quarterly investors' calls. (I think the number was 4% increase in costs due to capacity reductions ... but I've been up all night)

As employees there is nothing we can do in the face of management outsourcing except unity. This is where mainline pilots every where have let you, me, and this profession down. There should have been no Comair growth at Delta's expense. There should be no GoJets growth at Comair's expense. We should be in this together.

Every pilot will have to decide for themselves what course of action is best. I'm sure Delta will keep Comair's employment / payroll records and use them during interviews. Probably best to grit your teeth, fly safe, show up and do the work you get paid for. If I were doing the hiring seeing someone work through the most adverse circumstances imaginable would be a huge credit to the applicant's integrity.

I never post, but I just wanted to say: Very well said. Easily one of the best posts I have read on here.

Flybye 07-30-2012 06:34 AM

Agreed. Bucking Bar your post is spot on.

hockeypilot44 07-30-2012 10:19 AM


Originally Posted by Dirt Doctor (Post 1237199)
Delta pilots want the flying. Give it to them all at once. I hope you all use your sick time on the same days. Might as well cost Delta as much money as you can before you leave. I have been out sick since November! They may win the war, but we should inflict as much damage as possible before its over.

That's a stupid business decision on your part. Hurting Delta will not help you. Delta will not even notice if you stop showing up to work....until you have an interview with Delta. Doing things out of spite gets you nowhere in life.

olympic 07-30-2012 10:45 AM

Yeah that's a stupid idea, but if these guys don't fly for the next 6 months after their company ceases operations they won't be even invited to an interview.

RJtrashPilot 07-30-2012 10:47 AM


Originally Posted by dmbmarkt (Post 1237319)
I never post, but I just wanted to say: Very well said. Easily one of the best posts I have read on here.

^^^^^^^ I know this guy. There's no hiding from me! :D

BlueMoon 07-30-2012 11:26 AM


Originally Posted by hockeypilot44 (Post 1237450)
That's a stupid business decision on your part. Hurting Delta will not help you. Delta will not even notice if you stop showing up to work....until you have an interview with Delta. Doing things out of spite gets you nowhere in life.

I usually never agree with hockey but he is right in this case.


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