I would think if the insurance company requires two "pilots", you would have to go through some type of training?
Also if the insurance company required it, I would think they would get the FAA to require it somehow in the op's specs?
I think I would personnaly LOG it as SIC turbine since it IS required by the company, and you are being paid for it.?

Looking at my post, I have a headache because "I think" alot!:o

I see where you are coming from, and I kinda think the same thing, but I am not taking the chance,
if an airline thinks it is SIC, I will let them tell me that it is SIC

I am not gonig to make the assumption that I can go ahead an log it

it is better to be safe than sorry

If you have manipulated any control without a 135.293 ride you have broken FARs. This includes talking on the radios. Part 135 requires a .293 check for all PICs and SICs. Therefore, without a .293 check, accompanied with the required training, there can be no SIC time logged, nor can you do anything for the flight. Under 135, you can log SIC time in a King Air 90 provided it is a passenger-carrying flight under IFR, and you have the required training and checkride. Better be careful advertising to the general public that you have violated FARs, especially since you included where you are flying.

Insurance and FAA are two different entities with different requirements. I guess you could keep an "insurance logbook" that includes the time the insurance requires you to be there, but the guidelines for logging that time would be sketchy at best. As far as the FAA is concerned, the requirements to be SIC and log SIC time are spelled out fairly clearly in part 61 and 135. The FAA uses the term "required pilot" in conjunction with the applicable FARs, not insurance requirements.

From 61.51
(f) Logging second-in-command flight time. A person may log second-in-command time only for that flight time during which that person:

(1) Is qualified in accordance with the second-in-command requirements of §61.55 of this part, and occupies a crewmember station in an aircraft that requires more than one pilot by the aircraft's type certificate; or

(2) Holds the appropriate category, class, and instrument rating (if an instrument rating is required for the flight) for the aircraft being flown, and more than one pilot is required under the type certification of the aircraft or the regulations under which the flight is being conducted.


So the two things that dictate whether or not SIC time can be logged are the aircraft's type certificate and/or the regulations the flight is being conducted under. If you reference 61.55, it tells you the requirements for an SIC, which refers you to the applicable parts of 135, 121, or 91K.

Do you suppose he actually got invited to one of the SKW "group interviews" and is mistaking it for a 1 on 1 interview?

If the pilot in the left seat is an MEI, then log it as PIC dual received. Completely legal, I think???

If not, you are just along for the ride and I would not be putting that as total time in a logbook. However, it would definitely be worth mentioning at an interview!

I never put a single moment in my total logbook.
I have dont the mei dual stuff on the 91 legs

Are they having groups interviews in SLC on the Dec 1st?

Technically the FAA only wants to see dual received logged for actual training, for example:

1) A Cert or Rating
2) Currency
3) Aircraft checkout
4) An area or route familiarization


This is not in the regs that I am aware of but has ben clarified by FAA legal opinions in which common-sense reality checks have been applied. Basically you could easily do one or two flights, log it as dual received and it would be really hard to argue against 3) or 4) above.

But if you log gobs of time and numerous flights without an obvious need for 1) or 2), it would be very difficult to make a case that you were engaged in 3) or 4).

Some people do this anyway, but an airline interviewer would likely be aware of the dubious legality of the time in question. A few flights here and there should not raise any flags, but I wouldn't base a large portion of your ME experience on "dual received" of this nature.

I cannot disagree with your statment there rick.

I could not imangine that you would be talking of doing this when the flight is being operated under 135 with passengers on board.

I have never read anything that would allow flight training while flying part 135

Can you correct me if my thought on this wrong.


One other question that is not related to the ongoing subject.
If i was a troll, what would I be trolling for.

I do not think this is everyones thought, but made me think

thanks

If you and a buddy split time in a Seminole with one of you under the hood and the other acting as safety pilot, can the safety pilot time be counted toward your multi-engine total (as far as airline mins go)?

Legally yes. Just make sure you log it correctly...the safety pilot cannot log PIC while the hood pilot is taxiing, taking off, or landing! Subtracting 0.3 VMC per leg is the standard practice.

I have heard of a few airlines being less-than-excited about SP time, but I have no hard facts on that.

I could see where they could frown on that,

I think a bunch of sp time in there would be obvious to the airline on what you were doing,
I could be wrong here, but I thought that airlines wanted the time not because of time, but for experince, you need to have good time to have a good experince.
sp would just be there look at the world go by.

Well I guess I will talk to everyone in other threads, I could not imangine that there is much interest in this thread anymore.

Thanks for everyones help good and bad, I had a good time.
See ya around

reeves

I don't want to derail the orignal poster thread (good luck to you btw reeves).. but I just put in an app on-line and left a voice mail for Cassidy (would love to email her my resume, but don't have her email)..

I've got 4530TT, 1830 Turbine PIC (121/135) and 3700 multiengine.. Flew ATR captain at ASA, and CRJ/E120 FO as well as Citations under FAR135.. the catch? I've not flown in 2 years.. I did however do a recurrent about a year ago in the Citation X..

Do you think I have a chance?

edit: Well it wasn't hard, I called Skywest corporate offices and they gave me Cassidys' email, so we'll see..

CE750
goto pilotjob.com and look at skywest and look at the contact email listed there
and in the subject line put ATTN: Camille or cassady
Either one works just as well

That is what I did
and thanks for the good luck

Reeves

thanks Reeves, I just talked to a friend of mine (who's a new hire at SkyWest) and got the email as well as the phone to Jeff Curry.. he also recommended I email Camille.

Crossing fingers for both of us..

If you can get it all worked out, I am going down there on Dec 1st and be in SLC the afternoon before.
I would be happy see you there

Reeves

I called a buddy of mine who is an IOE captain on the Brasillia, and just upgraded on the jet a few months ago. He spoke to Camille and she said that they were hiring under the minimums if you had done an RJ trainins course like the one at MESA or if you went to the flight school run by one of the CEO's nephews, and got a recommendation. Other than that he said its 1000/100. reeves, did you do one of those RJ courses? Either way you are a lucky man.

well that makes a little more sense on why I got an interveiw.

We went up to our campus this summer and took a 25 ground school CBT on the CRJ 200 FMS and 8 hrs of hands on honeywell FMS systems with a cert of completion from our university.
it was administered by one of our profs and a captian with United Airlines

BTW Reeves.. don't feel guilty about having 600 and getting an intervew.. When I was hired (the first airline job I got) by ASA back in 1997, I was at 980TT, in my class was a bunch of 600-800 new-hires. It's all supply/demand. In the end, these are entry level positions (in my case, re-entry).. and in a matter of a year of flying the line under the guidance of experienced captains you'll get very comfortable.

Let's all just be thankful that the tide seems to be turning.. the majors are all recalling, and there is rumor of street hiring there in the next year or so.. It's about time!

you seem to be one of the rare ones that seems to be accepting of me,

I mean no disrespect to any of the others by saying that

I am really looking forward to it
even it if the interview does not go well, I still have never been to SLC
I am only out 40 dollars for the hotel room

Reeves

Hey y'all,

Saw this Skywest thread and since there appears to be a handful of SKYW folks monitoring, I figured I'd ask this question:

I interviewed last week, and at the end of the day the interviewers said they'd be contacting us by mail either way. It has been about 10 days and I haven't heard anything. Just wondering how long it typically takes to get the word (either way).

I left a voicemail for Camille today as follow-up. Any other suggestions?

that's because when I few as a captain on the ATR at ASA I found that there was no correlation between TT and ability.. Sure experience was an issue, and the low time FO wasn't capable of commanding an aircraft yet, but what I found to be the case was that the innate ability of an individual had more to do with whether he was a good pilot or not, more so than his hours.

I my last job I flew with an FO in the Citation X who had 11,000TT, most of it in flight instruction, and some in King Air, and some in Citation 500's.. now he was an FO in the worlds faster biz jet, and one heck of a monster to handle in x-winds.. He was borderline unsafe. His positional awareness was like a 300 instrument pilot, and his stick and rudder were poor at best..

In the end, you're either a good pilot or your not.. the number of hours only adds to your experience as either a good pilot, or not. :D

I would wait till the first of next week and email cassidy or camille if you had not heard anything yet

I have real good luck with both of them responding to my emails promptly
Camille has even gotten back to my on her blackberr.
But from both of their emails that I have got, they do give the impression that they are busy.

All of my emails that I have got have been short and direct to the point.
Much like we respond to each other in the forums.

CE750

My wife was asking if my time was going to be a problem, and at first thought, I thought it was just to get in to the interview, and beyond that it was all about me with in reason.

Then through the life of this thread I started to second guess myself, but slowly I have been going back to the first thought that the time was just to get the interview.
You seem like you me be along the same train of thought

Takes awhile for the horse to cross the mountains.

reeves, they still doing the 737 CBT systems and FMS course there? Also, was the united captain's name Randy?

Wait a minute, I thought SLC was know for the LDS, not the Amish :)

Yeah the Captians name was Randy DeMik

As far as I know Mr Welsh was still doing the king air 737, and maybe some citation all on CBT Now as well as the CRJ stuff, we were the test program to see if there was interest and I think the CRJ is going to offered this spring or next fall to Jr and Srs

If you need more info I can call up to campus and find out for you

Reeves

thats ok, thanks

were you from ISU?

If you dont want to admit I would understand

Reeves

I did go there. It wasn't overall a great experience for me. I just got in, got my degree, and got out. It was just a means to a degree for me. I learned a little in the process. Welsh had some of the best classes there.

How long ago were you there

Welsh is still there, and a good friend, but it still seems like he has licked one too many batteries

Kids still hate his weather class

Not long enough ago to tell you exactly when. Still know some people up there. I guess that may be forever though. I was there back in the Buck Greenlaw days.

I remember showing up to his weather class for the first day bright and early in the morning, and he comes in YELLING "GOOOOOD MORNING!" I knew then and there that he was on something.

Buck still calls down here from time to time.

That is welsh to a tee, he has not lost one bit of energy

Buck Greenlaw...? I instruct with Buck up here in Green Bay. Lots of good stories to tell.

Does he tell he feels like the north end of a southbound mule

Give him our regards here at SkyKing, and reeves says hi

Tell him to come and visit too

I am sure someone needs a cross country up there

I remember when skyw was at 500 total time pre-9/11.

Remember, skyw is very good with smoke and mirrors.

Please expound, what do you mean by smoke and mirrors?