Signing a training contract- IS IT WORTH IT?
 

(In your opinion, of course)
Okay everyone, since so many are in the thick of fighting the good fight at their respective regional workplaces every day I'd like people who have training contracts to give me, and other prospective entrants, some insight in to what you signed for ($/time length) at what operator and if you regretted it at any point? I personally despise this contract bs and hope to give some personal level reference for those walking in to the recruiting room with SJS. If everyone opposes those signing bonuses, they will simply have to vanish, but of course they are still out there. Shed some light!

Any outfit that required a training contract immediately made my "absolutely avoid this place" list. There is typically a reason they have a training contract.... and it's because you're going to want to leave ASAP.

You need to better educate yourself on training contracts and sign on bonuses.

RAH, has a training contract for the Ejet worth two years or 20K I believe that the one for the Q400 and the ERJ was dropped. This is a training contract and has nothing to do with the 5k bonus to attend class. You can go to RAH and not take the 5k but you will still owe them 2 years or 20K if you take an Ejet class.
***A RAH pilot please chime in as I don't have all the details.

Great Lakes, has a training contract for the first 15 months after you complete training worth 7.5K

Eagle, does NOT have a training contract. It has a 5k come to class bonus and if you take it is worth 2 years of service pro rated if you leave. But you can come to Eagle and not accept the 5k and not owe the company any money or anytime.

~~There is a big difference between sign on bonus and training contracts~~

Unless you're just looking for currency I wouldn't worry about a contract. 1 to 2 years will fly by. You probably need to stay on that long to built some quality time anyways.

There is always a reason for a training contract. Think about it, not everyone does it, and the ones that do don't offer them for no reason......

Compass has one and I wouldn't categorize them with the others...pretty sure because of the ATP/PIC type for everyone.

Most people do not realize that if you sign a training agreement (contract) and then on say day 92 you get fired for some reason, it may not even be a reason under your control or one that you even agree with, then you are liable for paying the whole thing back with some of these things. I would be super reluctant to sign any contract, even the pro-rated variety. At least pay a lawyer to spend an hour reading it to you and advise you what it is going to be like if the company terminates you prematurely then sues for the money. One would be inclined to say oh, no company would terminate and then sue, but you would be badly mistaken because it happens. Pilots are often bad about not understanding the contacts they sign, and pay dearly for it.

I signed a 5K/2 year contract at eagle about 2 years ago...ditched that **** hole after 9 months...nothing. They harassed me to pay my last travel expenses (20 bucks) But nothing about the contract.

Eagle did not have a 5K/2 year contract 2 years ago, these 5k has only been around for 6 months. What you did was the low time class and AMR tacked a 5K value to it for hiring you as a low time pilot. These contracts are made to deter people from jumping ship.

*** Many here have said that training contracts haven't been enforced for the most part at most airlines.

True.......

The answer is a resounding NO !

Flexibility will be the name of the game at the regionals in the next few years and the LAST thing you want is to be financially chained to carrier X. You may want to persue other options before the contract is up like another regional, an LCC or a legacy. You may even get opportunity outside the airline industry.

Let's face it...........a training contract is an indication of a company that is desperate and either cannot retain qualified people or attract them in the first place. It's a red flag of danger and an employment mine for pilots.

My advice is to treat them like illicit drugs and just say "no".

Is it worth it? That is up for you to decide. Should a company require one? That, too, is up to you.

Personally, I have signed two: one at an excellent 135 company and the other at a less than desirable 121 company. In both cases, I fully expected to stay for the term, but was willing to repay the prorated amount had I been hired at Marvelous Mainline.


If you sign one, be willing to live up to it either by serving the time or paying what is owed. That is what an honorable person does. Not living up to the contract, IMHO, is as sleazy as many of our upper managers.

Yes they are worth it unless you think you'll be off to a major in less than 2 years. It's a sleazy move to have the company spend $30,000+ then quit a couple months later. The rest of your pilot group will feel the pain when the company's expenses are too high and they can't win bids for flying causing furloughs.

AND it's not pro-rated. If you leave one day shy of your 15 months AFTER your checkride (unpaid during training), they have and WILL come after you. A common company tactic is to let many go into collections, then come after all of them at once. After it goes to collections, the interest rate kicks in and you'll pay closer to $20,000.

Don't be a sleazy company and people won't think about repaying the sleaze by ditching out.

I understand signing a training contract if the training provides you a type rating that you can immediately use elsewhere. No company can sustain being a training factory. Yes, they COULD be a better place to work and thus MAYBE not need one, but still, I get it.

That said, I have reluctantly signed one pro-rated contract when I was in a job bind. It's was a good company, but the a/c did not require a type.... kinda made me mad.

To each their own if they wish to sign one.

That type rating is required for me to do my duties, you want ROI then make it worth it... Screw all of you that say the regionals can't pay or I have to pay my dues.

That sounds like something a regional lifer would say. Do you want to be paid what you're worth? Then apply to Comair. They tried handing out the best contract to try and set the status quo for the industry.

It is real simple: sign ONLY if you have every intention of fulfilling your end of the (SIGNED) bargain. Otherwise don't sign it.

Really, this is coming from the kid who says "I'm ok with a crappy contract, so we continue to grow".

I'd say sign it, you will probably stay long enough just getting time in type. Our company asked for one, everyone signed.

Besides, if an employer wants you, they'll buy out the unpaid balance. I was offered just that by a potential employer who asked if I had one (it had long expired, anyway). I'm not alone in that offer.

GF

A training contract is a big red flag. If an airline is a decent place to work it should be able to retain you without financial threats. Also consider that there will be many promises that airlines will make to you that will not be met. Perhaps you may pick an airline for a domicile that will be closed on you out of the blue, etc. You sign a lease, or buy a house, your significant other moves with you and gets a job, and then all of a sudden you are displaced or furloughed plus you have a training contract hanging over your head if you decide to bail. These type of situations inevitably happen in this industry. DON'T SIGN ANYTHING AND DON'T TAKE ON DEBT!

Bonuses are another matter. I think that bonuses for new first officers will go up and up based on the supply and demand of ATPs. Very few qualified ATPs are going to come aboard for $25,000 per year (much less sign a training contract) so airlines will have to continue to sweeten the first year pot and compete against each other for new hires.

The careers come at the places with branded flying. The same companies that award their regional flying to the lowest bidder creating the regional whipsaw. The regional pilots have tried standing up for ourselves time and time again and each time wound up unemployed. But if you would like history to repeat itself we can bring down all the subpar paying regional companies which would pretty much be all of them except maybe Skywest and Horizon.

A training contract is not a financial threat. It's a mutual agreement, period. If you don't like it then go elsewhere. Regional airlines don't make promises. They tell you straight up that they are under the mercy of the major carriers and may have to close a base here and there. I wouldn't sign a lease or buy a house until you get to a major and even then, there is instability everywhere in aviation. If you want a job where you don't have to move around a few times or get furloughed then you should not have become a pilot. What did you expect, the airlines to cater to the needs and wants of each pilot? If mainline takes a dump on regional flying routes and the company needs to close a base should the company ask the pilots first if that is okay? If somebody bought a house then they should just leave the base open and lose money? Why would anybody ever think about investing in a company who isn't out for the best interest of the shareholders?

Good on you!

Well, who comes first? Your employees, your shareholders, or your customers?' But it's not a conundrum. Your employees come first. And if you treat your employees right, guess what? Your customers come back, and that makes your shareholders happy. Start with employees and the rest follows from that.

-Herb Kelleher-

I don't think Karma will ever be convinced, but I'll try any way with a little bit of why Southwest is where it is.

Just to throw this out there... Silver Airways DOES NOT have a training contract. Alright... that's all I got.

That's not a good analogy. Lets analyse what's really going on here. Silver and RAH don't have a training contract for the same reasons. People in this industry make lateral moves all the time and leave Lakes, Silver, CommutAir, Piedmont to fly a jet or increase QOL. I don't even want to get into why they do it but the bottom line is that is an undeniable fact and that explains why places like Lakes and Silver have a training contract. You don't see very many if any people leaving RAH to move laterally and go fly at Eagle or XJT, maybe a few to Skywest if they are from the west coast. The reason RAH has a training contract is because they have hired a lot of overqualified people lately, ex. Comair, Colgan, Pinnacle, Ryan International, etc. Now that major carriers are actually hiring some of these people might leave and advance their careers before a reasonable ROI can be recovered. You didn't often see people leaving RAH before 1 or 2 years before all of the above existed which is why only in the recent years the training contract was added at RAH but places like Lakes and Silver have had one for ages. It wasn't added for the reasons you state, such as the employees are being treated badly. It's nothing more than a simple insurance policy. The company is dropping over $30k for top notch training at flight safety, it's just wrong to leave the next day.

So, are you saying that Silver does have a contract? I'm trying to sort through what you said, and waiting for the punch line...

Karma is right- if you want to protect the interests of stock holders, then sign a training contract. If you want to protect your own interests and those of your family, then don't.

I speak from experience. I've worked for 5 different "regional" airlines over the years. One had a training contract. The one with the training contract was the most unstable place to work and I left with about 6 months left on a 2 year contract. I never intended to not complete the contract when I signed, but after 2 displacements and a furlough I changed my mind. It's a difficult situation. You're damned if you stay and damned when you leave. It sucks when the bill for what you still owe on the contract shows up at your house (Yes, most of those contracts still try to charge you even if the company furloughs, or even fires, you). You people need to think about this before you sign the dotted line. You better explain it to your wives too!

The days of 250 hour pilots are over. What is a company really providing you as far as training goes nowadays? New hires should pretty much have 1500 hour ATPs now. Many guys already have type ratings and many hours in the aircraft they're being hired into. New pilots have got to stop looking at this like they're 18 year old buck privates signing on for a stint in the army. The dues (college and ATP) are already paid. The airline should be paying you enough to make you want to stay.

I count two sentences saying that Silver HAS a training contract and one sentence stating that Silver DOES NOT have a training contract. :confused:
And the winner is...........:)

RAH has been doing a training contract for years and years, just like Lakes and Silver used to have one. Recently as in the last year RAH added the 5K because they couldn't attract new hires. No the training contract is not because of the few guys from other regionals who came over they did it to control attrition. If you get there and after a few months you want out see ya, but if they limit you to 2 years you will likely stay since now you are on year 3 and starting over will be hard.


I have been in this industry 3 years, I don't know it all but I get my facts first, you make stuff up as you go. And by the way, recently RAH dropped the training contract in the Q400 and ERJ, if I was an over qualified pilot from another regional and all I was looking was for stop gap before I went to an Utra LCC, LCC or a major then I would take the ERJ or the Q since those airframes don't have a training contract and I believe I could even pocket the 5k and still walk away when I need to. SO your theory falls on it's face.

Great Lakes doesn't even consider you an employee until you pass your check ride, after that point you become an employee and now you owe them 15 months.

Me :cool:

Silver does NOT have a training contract (at this time).

They did have, until recently, a 2-year/$24,000 training contract. Each month of service reduced the amount by $1,000.

Ditto! Silver does NOT have a training contract anymore!! Let the exodus begin!!

I will sign a training contract only if the company will sign a contract stating they won't close my base or furlough/fire me for two years, and if they do they owe me a pro rated amount. If we are going to do this it has to be a two way street.

Amen brother!

Incur no debts.

Sign no contracts.

Do not move for, or chase a job.

Give us day by day the next day's bread.

These are good words for pilots to live by.

Exactly why I was confused.... Silver DOES NOT have a training contract like the Capt. posted above... Dunno why karma is saying they do.......... :rolleyes: