GoJets question
 

Question: Are the pilots at GoJets on a master "black list" of some sort?

Sorry don't know much about he reginals but know of someone that is trying to break into the flying business.

They say it's true...and it's been done in the past, so yes, I'd say it's highly likely.

its not a blacklist, its a magical scarlet S for scab that appears on their shirts during interviews!!

in all reality the majors dont care about the union/non-unoin bs that goes on in the regionals. Gojet pilots go on to the majors like everyone else

I would'nt say they wouldnt care, it just not as big a hurdle as lets say 3 dui's would be, BUT WE ALL KNOW WHO YOU ARE YOU SCUM

Here we go again...

The master list you refer to is the alpa national scab list, which goes back to the 1930s. Since go-jetters are not scabs (technically) they are not on that list.

There are however seperate lists in circulation for both the Freedom A and gojet pilot groups (and presumably a few others as well).

There are plenty of folks who will remember...do you want to run into one of us at a crucial career juncture such as an interview?

Bottom Line: Don't do gojets. I suspect you already know the right answer and are just wondering if you will get caught. Maybe, maybe not, but you will still have to live with yourself. There are plenty of other airlines hiring...

Imagine having a former TSA guy on your interview board at that big interview at SWA, CAL, FDX or UPS. Uncomfortable....:D

GOOD POINT.

There are also a ton of regionals hiring with relatively low minimums right now that have better pay and work rules. Why not go somewhere that will be more appealing in the long run?

Plus, if nobody goes there things will have to change....

Thanks....I will pass it on to him.

I don't know much about the regional other then I could not afford to be in a right seat for more then say.....about a month.

He is trying to to do something other then flight instruct and had asked if I knew anything about GoJets..... I guess I do know enough to tell him to check out this site to find the answer and pass on what all, so far, have mentioned.

Thanks.....

Branded like Chuck Conners
 

Hey, I saw 2 Trans States Pilots do everything but spit and kick a Go Jet pilot in Saint Louis last week!!

TSA is hiring like mad right now and I know a number of people that have been hired with very low times that didn't go through a bridge program. If you really want to work for Hulas at least go to the regional that doesn't exist to circumvent a scope clause and screw a pilot group.

The last GoJet thread had nearly 200 posts!!!

Hasn't everything been said that needs to be?


Cheers!

Well that depends, has anybody said how scummy BLOWJETS guys are?

Who cares if it is posted a 1000 times. Its is our job to keep it fresh in peoples head. There are still pilot out there that dont know about Gojets. It is my mission to never forget and influence the hiring department where ever I end up at to never hire these Gojet pilots.

Please elaborate. I'm curious how it really goes when they bump into each other.

Someone will always go there. Just like B6 or VX. People will suffer just about any indignity to keep flying.

They'll even transition from H-60s to E-2s! :D

I'm a perfect example...I went from H-46s to C-12s. So there you go.

If you go go GoJets, just make sure you plan to live in base. Not many people will allow BloJet pilots to jumpseat with them, even if the airplane is empty. And the GoJets union has gone the WRONG way to get reciprocal agreements with other airlines...

Touche :D

The H-60 union was stronger too.

There will always be people willing to go to GoJets because of these pilot academies (Regional Airline Academy and the worst of them all ATP) These places take thousands of dollars from kids who are just out of high school and want to fly a jet and wear the uniform. For this and only this, GoJets will always find pilots.

I would say that ATP and the likes contibute to the number of people, but there are other feeders too. Hang out with some Daniel Webster, ERAU or other Aviation College guys and all they think about is jets. Most of them would give everything but their left nut to fly a jet. And the only reason that they wouldn't give their left nut is becuase the college that they went to already took their right nut, and if they gave up their left one, they wouldn't be able to beat off to the poster of the CRJ (or even worse a 1900) they have hanging in their dorm room.

There will always be someone that lacks the self respect that will fly there just to do it....

I just cannot stand ATP's 90-day wizz kids. They're just not ready. Anyone can pass a checkride that they have a gouge to. That's just me.

"I will be an airline pilot in four months with ExpressJet." I heard this more f*cking times from a ppl student that I had a while back, a student who had no place in an airplane in the first place. He will soon be one of a million totally inexperienced, over cocky, shi**y flying ATP grads sharing our skies. I can't say all ATP grads are terrible, but I can say that it is impossible to be a good pilot after being zero time and getting three months of training and some ratings. After some instructing experience is gained, most turn out ok.

You are barking up the wrong tree if you are looking for support on that one. I am one of those, as you so eloquently put it, "90 day wizz kids." I don't wish to hijack this thread, but take a look through the Flight Training forum and you can see what I think about ATP.

The problem is that they (ATP and others) take the airline thing to seriously. I never wanted to get into the regionals and all the convincing that they did still had no effect on me. But that's just the thing, is they push you to act like an airline pilot, CRM, checklists for wiping your butt, parading Airline guys through the office, etc. etc.

The point(s): Garbage in = Garbage out, have a good head on your shoulders and some good training behind you and ATP will be an excellent choice. There are people in their program making a career change, and if that person is already 40, then they are running out of time and are looking for the fast track. If other people want to take that fast track, fine, but then there is the rest of us that just love flying. Personally, I have a few more things to do in aviation before I am ready to worry about holding a line or wearing epaulets.

"There is a roll associated with Vmc? I have never heard of that! I thought that was another stall speed!" ATP Guy, Seminole PPL - MEL

I know that there is the potential for that crap, I've seen it. Someone that is there just to go through the motions would say that. Other people take as much as they are offering and then take it uppn themselves to get more over and above, these people are the ones with the self respect and aren't just in it for the letters they can put after their name.

I went to ATP with 180 hours and an instrument rating and have logged another 2200 or so since I left there. 1400 has been dual given, 32 checkrides and only 1 failure, and it wasn't even one of the 6 that went to the FSDO. I know others like me, and I know they would like this category that you are putting us in no more than I do.

I'm also just a 19 year old kid, and I had the choice to go to the aviation pilot factory or go to the local flight school at the FBO. I chose the latter and it was by far the smartest thing I did. I have recieved some really awesome flight training from some awesome flight instructors who have been around long enough to know what it takes to make a good pilot. I have been flying for 3 years and will go to a regional when the time is right and no sooner. There is more to life than a jet. Also, while I'm sure there are some good aviation schools out there, the one closest to the local FSDO where I live has a bad rep for always failing checkrides. I just want to let people know that not all of us kids are spoiled brats.

An airplane doesn't care if you're 19 or 45. Being older is no excuse. 90 days is barely enough to train a private pilot, let alone Commercial/CFI/MEI.
All the ATP grads I talked to admitted being "pushed" through the course, whether or not the had the required knowledge and skills. And the scary thing is after these 90 days, these guys start TEACHING OTHER PEOPLE TO FLY!

AVIVIII, I'm sorry to say, but I think these fast-track "schools" are a MAJOR contributor in the "race to the bottom" of the airline industry. I'm sure we all remember how not too long ago some were comparing the job of airline captain at a major with a medical doctor. Now, I personally never really agreed with that analogy, but it tells you how well respected this job USED to be. Thay was because at the time to become a pilot you had to go through throrough flight training (usually with the military) which took both time and a lot of effort. Now, I'm not saying we should all have master's degrees to fly for an airline, but 90 days of training? C'mon, lets get real! It takes almost double that to get the license to cut hair at Supercuts!! In fact most of those guys/gals have an associate degree in cosmetology.....2yrs of training:eek:

How do we realistically expect to raise the bar if we continue to have there guys "pumping out" jet FOs in 90 days of training ?:rolleyes:

IMHO, ATP is a cancer in this industry, and I consider it almost on the same level as the "pay-to-fly" programs.

By the way, to keep true to the thread, I have learned enough to not go to Gojets just to say I can fly a jet.

Your experience gained removes you from the category. ATP is just one of those places..... poor mgmt (not at making money, but in regards to customer service), wam bam thankya mam, go and fail because you can just try again.... type places. I was trained 61 and gained a lot of experience before I went there. I had a 1000 hours when I signed up for the 2 week CFI program. I was amazed at the mentality of the MGMT and the low time instructors. One of my instructors there was very very smart and was a good stick, but had failed two checkrides because of the rush to take the checkrides unprepared. Four of us in my CFI class were normal 61 types and none had failed a ride, while 3/5 of the ATP kids had failed atleast once. The four 61 guys, myself included, managed to pass each CFI ride, while about a third of the ATP kids were not so lucky.

I have only been exposed to the JAX location, I hear some are better. Moral of the story, I am not going to prejudge anyone who went to ATP. But if they show signs of being a ****ty pilot...I will know who to blame.

AVIVII, I had not read your last post when I replied above.

Agree 100% with what you write.

However, answer this question: would you recommend someone to train at a school where you are rushed through all your ratings in 90 days and where you might be taught by an instructor who set foot on an aircraft for the first time only 3 months before you?:rolleyes:

What can you say about the quality of flight instruction you provided when you were fresh out of the 90 day course, after ONLY 2 WEEKS of training to obtain ALL 3 instructor licenses?

Try to be honest....

Honestly, I didn't feel rushed. I too, was at the JAX location and based on my experiences at other locations, I wouldn't want to be anywhere else. I definitely would not have a problem recommending ATP to someone. Granted, it isn't for everyone. I was fresh out of a very challenging and fast paced engineering school, and had completely immersed myself in aviation. So to wake up and hit the books, go to the airport and fly, do ground school over lunch, head to the sim to then end the day with some beers on the beach or by the pool, the whole time studying, learning and concentrating on airplanes was enjoyable for me. 90 days seems like a real short period of time to some people, but when you are doing it every day, instead of just once or twice a week, your retention is much higher and you are able to concentrate without all of the other outside influences and distractions.

To answer your question, I would definitely recommend ATP, but only to certain individuals. It is definitely not for everyone. As far as the CFI course is concerned, I had no problem what so ever with it. I think the main reason for that was that i did all of my commercial stuff from the right seat and had already been talking through all of the maneuvers and teaching them, regardless of whether I had to or not. On the same note, I was one of the unlucky ones that had to take my MEI ride, which is also the initial instructor ride with the FSDO (Some people got to take it with a DPE). Despite that fact, I have never failed a check ride. (** Knock on wood, I'm going to take my ATP next week!) Back to the CFI course, the man that taught the course at JAX was Walt Schamel, Master CFI. This guy was great I could not have asked for a better instructor. One of the instructors that I flew with for my II prep was on her way out and kind of acted like it, but over-all, I had no problems with them.

I really hate to see the place get such a bad rap around here. It did great by me because I put the time and effort in. Yeah, you are on a schedule, so if you start spending way too much time surfing on the beach and then fail your multi-commercial twice followed by flopping your commercial single, its not because of the school. Its because you weren't committed to the program. Even though they stuff a funnel in your ear and start pouring stuff in, it is still up to the individual to make something of it. The thing that really sucks is that there are people who can go through the program, do nothing, learn nothing and still pass the checkrides. Some of these idiots i wouldn't let wash my car, let alone fly a plane.

I am more than happy to answer any questions that anyone has regarding this topic. If you don't want to put it on the board, feel free to PM me.

oh yeah, and unless they changed the program, all of our training was part 61 too. I was there 3 years ago though. Like I said, I passed all of my check rides as did the other 3 guys that were in the program right along with me / lived with me.

If they have completely changed, then I don't know what to tell you. I had great instructors and had a great impression of the management. After I left I had many phone conversations with Jim K. while I was trying to decide my course of action. He helped me a lot even though I didn't decide to come back and work for him. All this negativity really does surprise me.....

I happen to know a Freedom guy who knew nothing about the hows and whys of the origination of Freedom, but was still denied a jumpseat because he's a Freedom pilot. As I'm sure you're aware, it still happens.