Elevation

Thanks for the responses.

Management, attitudes and machismo are the factors if I'm reading y'all right. Someone said I'm over-simplifting things as I try to draw comparisons. They are right. I am.

Aclnowledging my over-simplification of things, is there an approach to handling these that hasn't been tried? Is there another industry that's faced and conquered similar challenges using techniques heretofore untried? Does this boil down to some sort of cultural shift required at specific operators?

Anybody got ideas that can be tried out?

rickair7777

Bottom line nobody really cares if a diver-drive recklessly crashes. As was mentioned above the necessary regulation would put this sort of operation out of business, along with many others. A jump base might not even have more than one pilot, how do you supervise him? Are you going to screen every 250 hour CPL wanna-be for psych and personality fit? CIA, Delta Force, etc do that kind of thing but it isn't cheap. It's also not perfect either, so they err on the side of caution and reject anyone that they cannot definitely evaluate as a good fit (they have lots of applicants). How would you like to be all ready for your CPL checkride but fail the psych/personality screen... and be permanently banned from professional aviation? Not like you can go home, study, and come back to try again on something like that.

At some point you recognize that some activities carry more risk than others, and the participants should all know that. I don't jump any more for exactly this reason, I'm more afraid of the plane ride than the drop. And I jumped plenty in the mil... but that was 2-4 engine turbine aircaft flown by a professional crew according to SOPs.

firefighterplt

There is a dramatic difference between drop zones and how their pilots fly. I like to frequent one that has a contract for lots of mil jumping (many of my jumps were with a load full of Navy EOD/SWCC/etc guys training at the DZ...pretty neat), so ******ery is kept to an absolute minimum.

Most reputable drop zones have a good S&TA who will listen up if a jumper, especially a pilot jumper, reports unsafe flying. That’s the key though—reputable drop zones. Some have reputations for being the Wild West...

Elevation

I hear you about the economics and practical aspects.

Over the last couple of decades ARGUS ratings and ISBAO brought safety improvements by tying their certificates to an operator's ability to get customers. Could something like that work for mom and pop operations? ARGUS ratings, depending on what you think of them, seem to fill the gap between what FAA oversight can provide and what customers need. Could ARGUS evaluations or something similar be done at a cost that would be justified by reduced insurance rates, etc.?

This might be dumb. I'm spitballing here. I'm probably dumb.

rickair7777

Elite, wealthy travellers, and businesses, use ARGUS-rated services. They care about safety and liability. Different audience at the drop zones. Again, also comes down to cost.

Huell

I have seen quite a difference in drop operations. I don’t jump. Just can’t wrap my head around jumping out of the perfectly good aircraft.

I do wear an emergency chute for a good bit of my flying. I have two different jump operations about an hour from my house that have riggers that can pack my chute. Both are very loose operations.

I avoid those operations and enjoy the 2 1/2 hour drive to a very professional safe outfit. Everything is serious and they still have fun. They pack my chute and if ... IF ... I were ever to decide to jump, this is the place where I would do it.

TransWorld

On a commercial airliner or just on your glider / private plane?

neverposts

i knew a king air operator whos pilot dropped a main and destroyed the pt6 engine however much that costs. they hang a new engine and fly it out of a 2200 foot strip with power lines on both sides because the gas is cheaper than the strip 5 miles away with a 4000 foot runway. sounds safe...

Excargodog

Learned to skydive when I was young and foolish. Learned at a club that had a lot of USPA C-rated guys in charge of both operations and instructing. It was well run and reasonably safe. Then I PCS’d and the nearest two jump zones I looked at jumping at were ragtag operations with few rules and a lot of what at my former club/school we called “outlaw” jumpers. The jump pilots were similarly ‘iffy.’ I decided I really didn’t enjoy skydiving that much. One of the jump zones had a 182 crash with two fatalities the next week. The other lost a 205 or 206 when it’s engine quit shortly after takeoff although nobody died.

I decided to take up SCUBA diving. Perhaps not the brightest choice either...


https://www.tetongravity.com/story/m...t-and-activity

TransWorld

A relative of mine, in the 1850s, took up/accepted a dual. He was anti slavery. Wanted those who would be free to be able to vote. Very controversial. Took lead to his thigh. Limped with it the rest of his life. Kind of more dangerous than anything on the chart.

He and that well known guy from Illinois founded the Republican Party. He became a US Senator, Governor, and ran for Vice-President. All with the slug imbedded in his leg.