UPS 747 Dubai Final Report
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Many years ago as a newbie S/O on the 727, we were taught there were two lights to watch like a hawk. The Essential Power and the Lower Aft Body Overheat. Essential was obvious. The instructor said to consider the Lower Aft Body as the "No ******" light. No matter what the Captain said, we had a max of 20 minutes to get it on the ground before the structural integrity of the plane was gone.
In the mid 90's, a Kiwi 727 departed 36R at MCO and had a blown duct on departure. They made a 180 at the MCO VOR and landed immediately. The crew reported the controls were getting sloppy on final. After landing they fouln the entire aft section melted and the cable pulleys gone; the cables were running on the pulley bolts.
RIP to the UPS crew and heads up to all. Fire remains our biggest fear inflight.
In the mid 90's, a Kiwi 727 departed 36R at MCO and had a blown duct on departure. They made a 180 at the MCO VOR and landed immediately. The crew reported the controls were getting sloppy on final. After landing they fouln the entire aft section melted and the cable pulleys gone; the cables were running on the pulley bolts.
RIP to the UPS crew and heads up to all. Fire remains our biggest fear inflight.
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,235
The report indicates clearly that this alcohol trace was a byproduct of the means of death and NOT due to consumption . Read the full report for accurate information.
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,235
It should be noted that a Chief Pilot and the President of the airline have a video out stating that it was not a lithium battery fire. Regardless of the facts in the comprehensive and extremely well done accident report.
#54
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,235
I am not sure why he would have told me that. He is an Exec in the SCS Division. Maybe he meant that they could not be shipped as regular cargo, and had to be under a UPS Dangerous Goods Contract.
UPS/ICAO Battery Shipment Regs
Thanks for the correction. I guess I should have done a little more research.
UPS/ICAO Battery Shipment Regs
Thanks for the correction. I guess I should have done a little more research.
#55
The Soviets would be impressed by that propaganda film. What a disgusting display, but not at all surprising.
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Blue fifi flogger
Posts: 735
Had a Brown guy on the j/s a few weeks ago who mentioned the details were gonna suck. Sounds like FO Bell, an old buddy of mine from CHQ, fought that dying bird all the way to the ground. RIP brothers, what a crappy way to die
#57
Over and over, we find that a fire inflight is one of the most desperate situations imaginable. And the biggest lesson to take from all of them:
1) Be sure you have 100% O2
2) Land that puppy IMMEDIATELY, as in NOW, NO DELAY, screw comm, point it at the nearest suitable airport, tune 121.5, squawk 7700, tune the ILS if available, and LAND.
If you can do checklists, great. Do them while you are flying to a runway.
RIP gents.
1) Be sure you have 100% O2
2) Land that puppy IMMEDIATELY, as in NOW, NO DELAY, screw comm, point it at the nearest suitable airport, tune 121.5, squawk 7700, tune the ILS if available, and LAND.
If you can do checklists, great. Do them while you are flying to a runway.
RIP gents.
#58
FLYING MAGAZINE
Accident investigators have traced a fire that destroyed a UPS Boeing 747 in the United Arab Emirates in 2010 to the lithium batteries being carried in the cargo hold. Unless something is done to prevent similar disasters, the FAA now says such crashes are all but inevitable in the future.
A 322-page report issued by the UAE’s General Civil Aviation Authority determined that heat from the fire disabled the crew’s oxygen system and that smoke filled the cockpit within three minutes of the first warning, obscuring the pilots’ view. Both crew members were killed when the 747-44AF crashed on Sept. 3, 2010, near Dubai.
Investigators say the crash highlights the risks posed by lithium batteries, which are prone to overheating leading to intense fires. The NTSB held a two-day meeting in April to explore the dangers of these types of batteries. In a recent report issued by the FAA in conjunction with Transport Canada, the agencies predicted there will be an average of six cargo plane crashes between now and 2021, with four of them likely to be caused by battery fires.
Lithium backup batteries in the Boeing 787 Dreamliner overheated aboard two airplanes and prompted the FAA to ground the fleet for months earlier this year. Investigators in the UK, meanwhile, traced a fire this month in an Ethiopian Airlines Boeing 787 at London Heathrow International Airport to the lithium batteries in the airplane’s emergency locator transmitters.
The FAA has banned lithium batteries as cargo on passenger airplanes, but they are still allowed on cargo airplanes that do not carry passengers.
In the wake of the Dubai 747 crash, UPS has started using fireproof cargo containers as well as cockpit smoke hoods and oxygen masks that are easier to don. The company said it has ordered more than 1,800 of the fiber-reinforced shipping containers, designed to withstand fires for up to four hours.
The crew in Dubai reported the fire about 22 minutes into the flight. They tried to turn back to the airport to land, but smoke obscured their view outside and of the instruments. The captain’s oxygen supply also stopped working at some point. The 747 flew past the airport and crashed minutes later.
Read more at UPS 747 Crash Highlights Lithium Battery Danger | Flying Magazine
#59
So many flights carrying lithium batteries happen during long overwater flights that putting the plane on an airport - or even land for that matter - is not an option. Still, I'd obviously rather take my chances landing in the North Pacific over burning to death.
#60
Attending recurrent, our instructor had placed their portable smoke machine in the sim.
Generally they allow it to puff a couple times then shut it off as we run through the emer descent scenario, nothing new.
This time however, the machine stuck in the full "on" position and within a couple minutes filled the sim so full, I couldn't see my hand in front of my goggles.
We were 0/0, couldn't see the PFD's, MFD, radios.. nothing. We had selected mask and inter-phone from the mem items, but everything to follow was futile at best.
With 25 years of flying professionally, I sat there trying my best to feel around my cockpit in the midst of an emergency descent and couldn't help but think of this crew and what they had to be experiencing. Add to it the heat, stress and frustration of comm relays, etc.
Sim instructor couldn't see anything, we had to shut down and evac the sim.
Ended up setting the smoke alarms off in the sim bay and evacuating the entire building, class rooms and all.
It was an eye opening experience I'll never forget as I sat there doing everything I feasibly could to control my bird.
So, as it has been stated here many times, we must learn from this crew who were in an impossible situation.
Smoke in the cockpit or any sign of an onboard fire, find some pavement "now".
And may we never have to deal with this tragic event.
RIP brothers.
Generally they allow it to puff a couple times then shut it off as we run through the emer descent scenario, nothing new.
This time however, the machine stuck in the full "on" position and within a couple minutes filled the sim so full, I couldn't see my hand in front of my goggles.
We were 0/0, couldn't see the PFD's, MFD, radios.. nothing. We had selected mask and inter-phone from the mem items, but everything to follow was futile at best.
With 25 years of flying professionally, I sat there trying my best to feel around my cockpit in the midst of an emergency descent and couldn't help but think of this crew and what they had to be experiencing. Add to it the heat, stress and frustration of comm relays, etc.
Sim instructor couldn't see anything, we had to shut down and evac the sim.
Ended up setting the smoke alarms off in the sim bay and evacuating the entire building, class rooms and all.
It was an eye opening experience I'll never forget as I sat there doing everything I feasibly could to control my bird.
So, as it has been stated here many times, we must learn from this crew who were in an impossible situation.
Smoke in the cockpit or any sign of an onboard fire, find some pavement "now".
And may we never have to deal with this tragic event.
RIP brothers.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post