5 guys quit this week, presumably to enjoy Christmas at home before starting with another outfit, hence the increased 747 FO open time.

Here's hoping they, and all of you, have a very Merry Christmas no matter where in the world they happen to be.

Without wanting to step on any toes I was pointing out that it seems the FO's know how to say 'no' a bit more than the captains....could be wrong but seems to be a slight trend there.

You didn't step on my toes...and I will go a bit farther and say mostly it is the really senior Atlas (not formerly Polar that is) that don't get it (and I am an Atlas guy as some of you may know).

The culture however is changing and it is the bottom 200-300 numbers that are changing it...and some hard-headed unionists Captains like me.

Good luck all and Happy Holidays to everyone.

It's also the bottom 200-300 folks that are very portable and can make up their seniority very quickly somewhere else in just a few years based on mandatory retirements at the big 3. Makes 2016 kind of a hard line in the sand for me.

I'd go as far as to say iTs that way all the way up to the last 4.5 year hires

Right on KME. +1

kme, C5, and Timmy,

While what you are saying is likely so, you and others are here for now...and not sitting in a class at DL, UA, etc.

I also know that you are here because you like lots of things, while we are all convinced that it could get much better. The potential exists but it will mean we have to convince the top of the group to play ball our way...it is that simple, right?

So, while you are here, it is seriously time to try to make this place better. But the only way to make that happen is to...
1. Fly strictly per the CBA...no allowances to be made for anything.
2. Convince the naysayers to think in the long term, not just for their next pay check.

All the best to all of us in the new year...

100% agree with all....never meant to infer otherwise. Well said...thanks!

Going back to ALPA? Wow that is the way fwd. The teamsters seem to be in bed with the company. I think its our only chance of having a good contract. I cant think of any contract that the teamsters have helped an airline with that is industry leading. We are supporting the lot of airlines in this airline division. Being the little dog on the block would definately be to our advantage.

Concur...I like my job, willingly walked in eyes wide open and hope to stay put. My point is that you never have true negotiating power unless you are willing to walk away from the table. For a larger group than ever before, that is a potentially lucrative option.