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Honest question: why no union?

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Honest question: why no union?

Old 01-03-2018, 04:21 PM
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Default Honest question: why no union?

I understand that this question is inherently political, but my intent is to ask it as objectively (ie, apolitically) as possible as I have no Part 121 flying experience yet.

SkyWest is the only airline (regional or legacy/major) without a union. What unique factors or circumstances of any kind have created a situation where OO pilots benefit from not having representation, while other airlines’ pilots benefit from having representation?
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:39 PM
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They started out (like all carriers) without a union. Back in the day they were a very good place to work, you wouldn't make millions, but could live in base in low-cost and/or high QOL locals, and have plenty of time off. The founders did in fact care about peoples families.

Things have been on a downward slope since 2000-ish. But the SKW demographic includes a LOT of old-skool conservatives who want nothing to do with a union. The really senior inter-mountain west folks are mostly still taken care of, which helps. Also the west coast lifestyle crowd tends to not to want to think about airlines on their days off. Unions in general are more of an eastern/midwest thing in general, if you grew up in the east, everybody's dad was in the union, the mob, or both.

OO would probably benefit from it today, but there's a lot of momentum to overcome. The time to vote in alpa was ten years ago, the barn door is starting to swing in the breeze now. Also the large up-wardly mobile mid-seniority demographic doesn't want to to rock the boat before they get their PIC and get out.
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:40 PM
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SkyWest benefits from everything unions do without paying 1.9%. With that being the case why unionize. ALPA worked out KCM with the Feds, but SkyWest benefits. Had they been excluded they might unionize. Skywest management gives them all of the flying with decent pay rates and ok work rules. Why pay a union when your getting it without the dues?
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:45 PM
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This thread will go down hill fast once all the pro union/anti union people come in.
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Old 01-03-2018, 06:38 PM
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Koolaid that's why. I hope that we gather steam and get a union on property.
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:25 PM
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Outsider here: I think SkyWest seems to have a pretty good set of benefits/work-rules without a union.

In today’s rapidly-changing environment, not having a union may actually be beneficial as the company can rapidly increase compensation as needed.
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by dupe View Post
Outsider here: I think SkyWest seems to have a pretty good set of benefits/work-rules without a union.

In today’s rapidly-changing environment, not having a union may actually be beneficial as the company can rapidly increase compensation as needed.
Outsider here: ie. Harrison and Ford. I think SkyWest seems to have a pretty good set of benefits/work-rules without a union.


Re worded:In today’s rapidly-changing environment, not having a union may actually be beneficial, to the company, as the company can rapidly increase compensation as needed and not have to deal to the rest of the pilot group.

There's a reason the company has a huge header about unions and how associating with them is basically getting in bed with the devil and hitler.

Thank you Harrison and Ford, for your kindly reminder!
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:45 PM
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So, in other words... the company can raise first year pay to $100k if it wants to and not do anything for the rest of the pilots. And there's nothing the pilots can do collectively because they don't have a legally enforceable contract.
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by DirkDiggler View Post
So, in other words... the company can raise first year pay to $100k if it wants to and not do anything for the rest of the pilots. And there's nothing the pilots can do collectively because they don't have a legally enforceable contract.
Yep. No contract, no rules.
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Old 01-03-2018, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Cefiro View Post
This thread will go down hill fast once all the pro union/anti union people come in.
I understand there's plenty of passion behind both sides, but I'm trying to focus on what differentiates OO from other airlines (i.e., why is OO the only non-union airline?) rather than spurring discussion over whether OO should or shouldn't unionize. To that end, it seems several themes emerged from responses thus far:
1). People used to be more highly regarded at OO, but the airline has become more corporate. (My question: Given the changes that have already happened at OO, what has kept unionization from occurring already after the airline changed? Also, has the future likelihood of unionization at OO increased?)
2). Senior members of the pilot group perceive themselves to be benefiting from the absence of a union and many of the mid/junior pilots don't see it worth rocking the boat to push for a union given all the movement currently present in the industry. (My question: Why/how is OO's situation any different than every other airline in this regard??)
3). The OO pilot group benefits from the rest of the industry being unionized without having to pay. (My question: If this is the case, what has kept other airlines' pilot groups from seeking to disband their respective unions to achieve this same effect?)
4). OO management influence against unionization. (My question: Why/how has OO management been more successful at preventing unionization that other airlines' management?)
5). The OO pilot group sees values in giving management flexibility/agility, particularly with respect to compensation. (My question: Why don't other airlines' pilot groups see this same benefit?)
6). The OO pilot group is generally satisfied with management. (My question: Is OO's management truly better - in both character & business acumen - than other airlines' management? Also, do OO pilots have different - lower or higher? - expectations for their management than pilot groups of other airlines?)

Thanks to all who commented and those who do so in the future, particularly in response to the questions in parentheses above.
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