SkyJunky

Mind if I ask which base?

TheBlueBaron

DAL

filler

apufire

In general, do you find yourself being fatigued after trips at Southwest? I'm just wondering if the Southwest lifestyle will be sustainable for someone as they get into their 50's and 60's.

Also, I have a few friends who fly for Southwest and they like to tell me that they can make more money than someone at a legacy carrier with the same time at a company. If that's possible, does it require working more than usual? I'm sure my friends aren't lying to me, but they also seems like the types who would jump at any additional flying, whereas I'm the type to just fly my schedule and have more time at home. I don't mind work, but if I can make the same amount by working less, that would make the decision easy.

I'm about 15 months from military separation and starting to fill out my apps, so just wanted some perspective from the masses. I plan on applying everywhere; maybe I'll be lucky enough to have some choices.

kingairfun

I may be wrong but I think a 2nd year SWA guy makes about $300k working about 6 days a month... On the other hand, at a Legacy you'd have to work 23 days to break $100k

ROFF

If you bid/trade into/pickup high time, brutal AMs, long days etc. then yes you’ll probably be tired. Fatigued? If there’s some other factor then possibly.

Flying what works for you is the best way to avoid being worn out. If I did a 4 day East coast 4 day I’d probably fall over asleep on day 2. No way in hell I am doing those. Some people love them. Even get a run in before the van.

I have no idea what my friends make at the legacies. I don’t care. My house is big, my pool is big, there’s 3 cars in the driveway and my wife stays home with the kids.

WHACKMASTER

The good thing is that there is choice. For example, I try to maximize my $/days worked ratio and thus end up doing some really productive and high credit trips which I feel fortunate to be able to do. Naturally they’re ball busters but they give me a lot of time off.

My friend who’s also in my domicile around the same seniority gets his rocks off by doing lazy trips that pay the daily rig (6.5/day) and block low. This way he gets long overnights where he can do things that he doesn’t get to do often enough at home. For example, workout as he does marathons and all that.

I revolt at the thought of wasting my time at work and only crediting 6.5/day while he looks at my trips that probably average 8.5/day and is fatigued just seeing them. To each his own.....

On a narrowbody at the Legacies you don’t necessarily have the highly productive trips that you have at SWA and if they’re out there they’d be such a small percentage of the flying on that category that it’d go very senior. A good example of this is how senior B737 ATL is at DLA. It’s got a lot of Caribbean day turns and thus “good flying” and is fairly senior for a narrowbody.

What you do have though at AA, DLA, & UAL is a tremendous amount of variety thanks to so many different fleet types and at least for the 2020s, much greater seniority progression. If you can get on a widebody at any of those carriers then the flying can be really good and productive. The same can be said for Fedex & UPS.

If you do come to SWA and want to fly lazy trips that only pay 6.5/day then you can do that all the time. Believe me, people are always trying to give those away.

Also, keep in mind that when I reference credit per day with SWA it’s TFP (trips for pay) which is basically block hours (how you get paid at every other airline) multiplied by 1.15 to get TFP.

WHACKMASTER

Just reread your post and just to add onto my reply....you can make the same at SWA working less days at a Legacy IF you work some better paying trips (generally more flying per day) BUT once you can hold widebody flying at a Legacy that can be very productive as well. We don’t have that option.

The manning ratio of pilots/airframe has changed quite a bit for us and the opportunities to snag high paying 1.5X trips has drastically dried up. Whether that comes back or this is truly the new norm is constantly being debated.

saab2000

Keep in mind that the overall fatigue battle is heavily related to whether or not someone lives in domicile. I am about to move to my base and having lived in domicile before, I know it's a totally different job and we bid different things when we live in domicile. Commutability is no longer my primary focus. Productivity becomes much more important.

As mentioned, SWA offers lots of choice and there's more overall scheduling flexibility than anywhere I've ever been before. Want to fly your line and have 17-18 days off? No problem. Want to pick up a give-away trip at straight pay to pad your schedule? As mentioned, they're pretty easy to pick up from other pilots who are trying to clear their boards in order to play the open time game or for whatever reason.

I don't know what I'll do when I'm in base but I think I'll initially try to work a bit more and I'll still have more overall time at home than I have now even with my relatively easy driving commute that still normally has me coming in the night before a trip.

This is part time job if you live in domicile and don't choose to work extra. For anyone who doesn't need the income and likes the flexibility and time off it's pretty hard to beat.

That said, I'm currently in the middle of a 3-day trip that initially credited 26.9 TFP and will now be just under 31 TFP after some significant day 1 disruptions and subsequent reroutes and move-ups. It's like an RJ trip from days past, only maybe even harder. But it pays way, way better than the RJ ever did. Put into perspective, a lot of 4-day trips here only credit 26 TFP.

e6bpilot

I will pile on. The answer is that it depends.

As was stated above, when you have one giant fleet, there is a big menu of flying to go with that. Some of that varies by base, but mostly not.

We are mainly divided into AM and PM shifts with some mid day bleed over since our flying days have become so long. There are currently no scheduled flights that cross the 2-4am boundary (local time), although in the summer it may happen on a delay. I mainly fly PMs because my body does much better and I feel much better waking up without an alarm and having a few hours to adjust before flying late. Some do better with AM flying....it just isn’t for me.

So, on a typical day, I will report at 3-4pm, fly two to three legs, and get to the overnight in between 10 and midnight. That’s typical. There are also plenty of trips that fly one medium leg and get in earlier or have a longer overnight. It’s all in what you want to fly.

For me, if I am flying a regular, straight time trip, I prefer an easy, low block, 19.5tfp 3 day that has long overnights and or is commutable. I find that it results in one of two outcomes - either a relaxing and fun trip that I can commute both ends, or it opens me up to reroutes and move ups where I can make a lot of extra money. Either way I am good with it because like whack, I am at work to make money, not hang out in airports and stare at people.

If I am flying the rare premium open time trip or something of the sort, I want high block, dense days with lots of overfly and maximum deadheads.

To each their own. We have a varied menu here. One good thing I will say is most of us identify as either an “AMer” or a “PMer”. I think that results in better circadian management and less fatigue when those trips go as scheduled. Since I do occasionally fly both, I can tell you that they are essentially two different airlines as far as the people and stress level goes.

sMFer

Awe muffin ...you can have the jumpseat anytime you want!

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