Originally Posted by PNWFlyer (Post 3828716)

Spirit has entered the chat.

Originally Posted by Lewbronski (Post 3828623)

You're an example of exactly what I'm talking about. Classic.

Because neither you nor SWAPA understand the RLA, we made massive strategic mistakes that put us in the position we ended up in.

Tell me: how long did SWAPA wait to file for mediation after opening negotiations? Currently, what is the average time in mediation of cases before the NMB and what does that have to do with anything? How did the amount of time SWAPA waited to file for mediation impact our leverage this past cycle?

That one enormous mistake alone was likely irrecoverable. And it's because SWAPA and this pilot group do not, and have never, understood the RLA.

Originally Posted by REF 5 (Post 3828833)

As some others have said, time to move on. I can remember when some airlines had parity plus one(under the RLA), guaranteed pensions(under the RLA), no furloughs(under the RLA). Contract's can only be administered when the companies finances are as such to make it happen. Companies will ALWAYS try to manipulate it to their advantage. Even with "iron clad language". It's a simple as that. Time and time again that has been proven. Their is a big genenration of pilots that were in diapers or not even born when contracts were gutted. Wiped out. ALL negotiated under the RLA. Iron clad language to boot. SWAPA's contract is not perfect. But if you think its sub par, that's your opinion. Most though, saw enough improvements to vote yes.

Originally Posted by RJSAviator76 (Post 3828782)

Are you trying to compare us to Spirit? 🤣

Originally Posted by Lewbronski (Post 3828415)

The sick leave issue for pilots out for an extended period, among many other issues, could have been solved by applying leverage to our contract negotiations. However, again this cycle, we failed to secure solid, specific contract language to address the predicament we now find ourselves in. If you believe SWAPA and 93% of the pilot group, it was at least partly attributable to the belief that we did not have enough leverage to achieve a truly industry-leading contract. That thought was undergirded by an almost complete, and I would say negligent, lack of understanding of the RLA. That, in turn, resulted in a nearly complete failure to leverage the best negotiating environment for pilots since the 1960's or earlier.



As it stands now, the company is not even taking advantage of a loop hole in our sick leave use policy. They are simply applying the policy, as written in the contract, handed to them by 93% of the pilot group who voted "YES!!!"



It's not like management just started acting this way recently. But like an infant playing peek-a-boo, SWAPA and the pilot group seem surprised every time the company pops its head back up doing the same old sort of thing again.

It has been going on at least as long as I have been here - for about two decades. It's pretty comical. We seem to have had the learning lobe of our brains lobotomized when they offered us the kool-aid and Nikes at new hire training.

But it's not funny for the pilots who will be effected by the sick leave use language we agreed to. Now pilots out on an extended sick leave will be sacrificing some or a lot of their vacation accrual, costing them future income and saving the company cash.

And I know we all can't wait to start riding those middle seats on nearly every DH when we go to assigned seating. But that probably won't be all that hilarious either after the fifth or sixth time.

Oh well, there's always 2032.

Originally Posted by Lewbronski (Post 3828623)

You're an example of exactly what I'm talking about. Classic.

Because neither you nor SWAPA understand the RLA, we made massive strategic mistakes that put us in the position we ended up in.

Tell me: how long did SWAPA wait to file for mediation after opening negotiations? Currently, what is the average time in mediation of cases before the NMB and what does that have to do with anything? How did the amount of time SWAPA waited to file for mediation impact our leverage this past cycle?

That one enormous mistake alone was likely irrecoverable. And it's because SWAPA and this pilot group do not, and have never, understood the RLA.

Originally Posted by 123AB (Post 3828774)

Thanks for the pick-me-up from everyone above. I guess I let myself get worn down from some back to back trips and a few CAs constantly bantering about furloughs. Just wrapped up a trip tonight and have the next 6 days off. Going to get away for a bit and rejuvenate and get my positive attitude back on track.

Originally Posted by KPer (Post 3828969)

The CAs you've been flying with are a$$clowns. We are not perfect here, but you'll be fine. They are just bitter about the choices they have made while they collect $400K/year. Many of them could barely make minimum wage outside of a cockpit.