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-   -   Where did the pens go? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/spirit/124565-where-did-pens-go.html)

MCDUmanipulator 10-08-2019 08:05 AM

Having recently gone through training the company is indeed wanting to heat up the brakes. During my oral my examiner went into a 15 minute presentation on why we should almost always use auto brakes low with idle reverse. Reasons were mostly better brake efficiency and wear as well as passenger comfort.

Omniscient 10-08-2019 08:18 AM


Originally Posted by MCDUmanipulator (Post 2900210)
Having recently gone through training the company is indeed wanting to heat up the brakes. During my oral my examiner went into a 15 minute presentation on why we should almost always use auto brakes low with idle reverse. Reasons were mostly better brake efficiency and wear as well as passenger comfort.

I’ll just suggest you see how efficient this works after a full summer on the line. An example is all new hires get auto brake usage crammed down their throat in training and once on the line after some time, realize they would rather use manual braking unless specific conditions exist for auto brakes. Very few guys I fly with use low auto brakes arbitrarily; real world flying education comes in. Just like we aren’t always vectored to 2000’ AFL at 180kts for optimized energy. Training techniques are great; but the planes don’t have a “brake temp reset” button like the sim does.

FLYBOYMATTHEW 10-08-2019 08:40 AM

Which costs more in the long run, replacing brakes more frequently, or missed connections, rebookings and hotels for delayed takeoffs due to hot brakes? There are costs associated with such fantasized efficiencies. Stepping over dollars to pick up dimes IMO.

Omniscient 10-08-2019 08:54 AM


Originally Posted by FLYBOYMATTHEW (Post 2900244)
Which costs more in the long run, replacing brakes more frequently, or missed connections, rebookings and hotels for delayed takeoffs due to hot brakes? There are costs associated with such fantasized efficiencies. Stepping over dollars to pick up dimes IMO.

Boom. Facts.

Sorry if someone thinks I’m going to hold short of a runway for 45 minutes waiting for brakes to cool before take off, with a soft time trip, all because the company wants to reduce brake wear. What’s the phrase again? Oh yeah, profit sharing. We are labor, not partners.

sioux8ships 10-08-2019 09:58 AM


Originally Posted by Omniscient (Post 2900256)
Boom. Facts.

Sorry if someone thinks I’m going to hold short of a runway for 45 minutes waiting for brakes to cool before take off, with a soft time trip, all because the company wants to reduce brake wear. What’s the phrase again? Oh yeah, profit sharing. We are labor, not partners.

Exactly, and respect your fellow co-worker!
-don’t give a plane to a crew with super hot brakes..
-don’t leave the trash in the cockpit
-don’t leave your tray table with crumbs all over it.
-plug in the company headset.
-open the vents
-pull the shades if the sun is blasting in.

No need to dim the screens, especially the radar! This isn’t your md-80 or dc9 with CRT’s that burn in.

MCDUmanipulator 10-08-2019 10:10 AM


Originally Posted by Omniscient (Post 2900220)
I’ll just suggest you see how efficient this works after a full summer on the line. An example is all new hires get auto brake usage crammed down their throat in training and once on the line after some time, realize they would rather use manual braking unless specific conditions exist for auto brakes. Very few guys I fly with use low auto brakes arbitrarily; real world flying education comes in. Just like we aren’t always vectored to 2000’ AFL at 180kts for optimized energy. Training techniques are great; but the planes don’t have a “brake temp reset” button like the sim does.

Don’t shoot the messenger. I was told it’s going to become an emphasis item on line checks. Also they are no longer teaching the whole optimized profile thing.

BeechedJet 10-08-2019 10:41 AM

You know what I can’t stand, when there’s two pens in the holder and I can’t decide which one to use.

Omniscient 10-08-2019 10:59 AM


Originally Posted by MCDUmanipulator (Post 2900316)
Don’t shoot the messenger. I was told it’s going to become an emphasis item on line checks. Also they are no longer teaching the whole optimized profile thing.

Trust me, I’m not blaming you for some of the stupidity being taught. They can emphasize all they want on a line check, it isn’t a safety of flight issue and I’ll treat it as such.

sioux8ships 10-08-2019 11:29 AM

Pens are getting sucked into the #1 engine while running at the gate waiting for the ground crew to plug in external.

Flightcap 10-08-2019 12:00 PM


Originally Posted by sioux8ships (Post 2900364)
Pens are getting sucked into the #1 engine while running at the gate waiting for the ground crew to plug in external.

Nothing like having a giant Hoover running for five minutes with folks running around the airplane who have been on the job two weeks. Not scary at all.


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