Dan Sneddon

F9 319:

It is called math. When I got hired at Chautauqua, we were flying 19 seat turboprops. 10 years later 86 Seat (and then 99 seat) jets. Extrapolate another 20 years and wallah. A 30 year career based upon long -term growth at this Company.

Ask how many original Lake Central or Mohawk DC-3 First Officers thought they would have retired off of the A330? Ask how many original Republic (merged with Northwest) pilots thought they would retire off of the whale?

Once again logic vs. emotion. And still no substantive responses to any of my questions.

Dan Sneddon
Capt. Republic Airlines

Car Ramrod

No Lake Central, Mowhawk, or original Republic expected to end up where they did.

Just because you buy a lottery ticket every time you fill up your gas tank doesn't mean you expect to retire a millionaire. Sure, it happens for some people but not for the majority.

Let's call a spade a spade here: Any pilot who has been at Republic longer than 10 years is either unhireable or unmotivated. They aren't there because they think they will retire on a 747.

Mulva

Hey Capt. Dan,

I did some cyphering based on your "math". Using the 86:19 seat ratio in your post, I calculated a multiple of 4.52631579 which, when applied and extrapolated per your example, yields a pretty impressive result. Are you guys really banking on flying 1,761 (ONE THOUSAND SEVEN HUNDRED SIXTY ONE) seat aircraft in 20 years? Shizzle! Now that is some mighty heavy iron. Will the IBT357 be negotiating pay rates for that airplane in the ball park of 9,271% (inflation adjusted of course!) of those you received when flying that 19 seater? If so, then maybe assimilation into the IBT357 won't be such a bad thing.

Just thought I'd take a crack at beating back a bit of that ever present emotion with a sprinkling of logic and, admittedly, some sarcasm too.

BTW...what was your pay rate (inflation adjusted if you don't mind doing the math) when you got hired into that 19 seater? Just curious how it compares to your current rates.

AND just one more thing Capt. Dan. Do you mind sharing your decision making process (see next post #74) that led you to choose Chautauqua over UAL, Delta, NWA, LUV, etc. when seeking employment opportunities as a pilot?

Mulva

I'll throw a little credit where it is due and say:
The key word being "CHOICE" and we all have the right to make them as we see fit. Aside from the wildly successful ACA debacle, the vast majority of non-Military trained "Mainline" pilots chose to leave a "lesser" job in pursuit of the mighty "Holy Grail". Some chose not to for various reasons. Some also failed in their efforts (unhireable) while some simply never tried (unmotivated).

The spade is a spade! Can we kill this one yet?

FAULTPUSH

Whimp[sic]? FAPA has accomplished FAR more for us than IBT has for RAH, without threatening a strike.

Is it possible for you to drop a trip on the day of the trip?
Can you drop a lame overnight out of a trip just because you don't feel like spending 15 hours in SLC for 3 hours of pay?
Can reserve pilots make more than 100 hours pay a month by choice?
Can you swap out of a trip with another pilot in an outstation?
Can your reserve pilots move reserve days around?
Do your pilots create the lines, based on pilot input?

These are some of the benefits of collaborative bargaining. It's FAR more effective than "give us what we want, or we'll strike". With RPC, you have a chance of moving towards that kind of power. With IBT...well, I'll have to listen long enough to hear what the robot has to say the next time I get a call from "UNAVAILABLE".

FAULTPUSH

Wallah?

I'm looking at the disambiguation on wiki, without much luck.
Wallah - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wiscopilot

Sweet I'm voting for RPC!!!

Wait I can do all that now....

Dan Sneddon

And still not an answer to any of my questions about RPC. All of which have great impact on the future of Republic pilots. With so many pilots "in the know" why will no one answer these questions? Instead, pilots choose to character assassinate while avoiding the points made.


Mulva amd Faultpush, here is the hard line on career expectations as spoken by the (then) FAPA President: (this was also admitted as evidence). Most of the FAPA BOD was the same at this time.


June 22, 2009


Dear Fellow Pilots:

Frontier (including Holdings, Frontier Airlines, and Lynx) filed documents today with the bankruptcy court supporting a Plan of Reorganization (Plan) to be sponsored by Republic Airways Holdings Inc (Republic.) Republic’s offer begins the “auction phase” of the bankruptcy process that will end on August 11, 2009. During this auction phase other potential investors may submit competing bids for consideration by the court. Absent a better offer from another investor, and if Republic’s Plan is approved, they will acquire 100% of Frontier Airlines Holdings Inc. (Frontier) outright and fund Frontier’s emergence from Chapter 11 bankruptcy. In return Republic will pay $108.75MM, of which $28.75MM will be distributed to the Unsecured Creditors (including FAPA.) This potentially gives the Unsecured Creditors between 9 and 7 cents per each dollar of unsecured claim (depending on the final size of the unsecured claim pool).

Due in large part to our sacrifices and our continued commitment to providing the best service in the airline business, Frontier’s recent turnaround has been remarkable. In normal times, a successful turnaround such as this would no doubt attract significant interest from investors, but unfortunately these are not normal times. Many airlines have reported that the capital markets have their “no access” signs out and there is very little “at risk” money being made available to the industry. Despite innumerable overtures by Frontier management to investment banks, airlines, and hedge funds, Republic has surfaced as the only investor with a serious interest in Frontier, and as such, we must give Republic’s offer, along with its various terms, due consideration since Frontier simply cannot emerge from bankruptcy without receiving a significant cash infusion from a sponsor. The current $40MM DIP loan from Republic matures on December 1, 2009, and without a replacement loan Frontier would likely be forced to wind down its operation, sell its assets, and close the doors.

There are many terms and conditions within the Republic Plan that must be satisfied in return for this investment. Of interest to FAPA Members – the Republic Plan requires changes be made to our CBA including a 3 year extension (to March 2, 2015) of the amendable date and a change to Section 1.F allowing for “unlimited scope relief.” For all employees, the Frontier profit sharing plan will be replaced with a Republic profit sharing plan. Republic’s terms are initial “asks” and not changes that will be casually forced upon us. Republic has indicated that they plan to operate Frontier as a separate fenced off company and not merge seniority lists.

Republic is acting as an investor and has tasked Frontier Management to negotiate on their behalf, so we have begun negotiations over these terms with Frontier management. Once again, untenable circumstances shape our reality: capital market conditions dictate that we cannot simply dismiss these terms outright. We are forced to take a hard look at our circumstances just as we have had to each time concessions have been required of us. If negotiations are successful, these “asks” will become more palatable and still allow our Members and Frontier to move forward.

The CBA remains binding unless/until we agree to acceptable changes or unless/until the court, through contract rejection, forces changes upon us. In order to preserve our rights under the CBA we intend to dispute a breach of the Successorship language (1.H), which requires a successor entity acquiring the Frontier to assume the terms of our CBA in total. Republic is insisting we modify our CBA prior to their acquisition.

“1. This Agreement shall be binding upon any successor or assign of the Company unless and until changed in accordance with the provisions of the Railway Labor Act, as amended. For the purposes of this Paragraph H, a successor or assign shall be defined as an Entity, which acquires all or substantially all of the assets or equity of the Company through a single transaction or multi-step, related transactions.
2. No contract or other legally binding commitment involving a successor or assign shall be signed or otherwise entered into unless it is agreed as a material and irrevocable condition of entering into, concluding and implementing such transaction that the successor shall be bound by this Agreement, shall recognize the Association as the representative of the Pilots, and shall assume the employment of the Pilots. "

If we are able to reach an agreement with Republic and ratify changes to the CBA in accordance with what Republic seeks, the grievance will be dropped. If we aren’t able to reach agreement, we have the ability to object to the Republic Plan in court, but Republic has the ability to withdraw their sponsorship if we do not agree to the changes they are demanding.

In order to ensure that Frontier remains viable, our contract survives, and most importantly - that our jobs and futures are as secure as we can make them in these uncertain times, we must look at our situation as dispassionately as we are able. Negotiations between FAPA and Republic have begun and will be on the fast track. If another investor, prior to the deadline of August 10, 2009, makes a competing bid the auction will be held on August 11. Assuming we are successful in negotiating changes that we can live with, we intend to have roadshow style informational meetings starting after the July 4th holiday and prior to a voting period of at least 21 days. Sean Menke and Republic CEO Bryan Bedford have pledged to attend some of these meetings. This is the most important vote of the bankruptcy process and I encourage everyone to attend at least one meeting in order to make an informed decision prior to casting your vote. We will keep you advised of new developments as they occur.

Sincerely,


John Stemmler
President
Frontier Airline Pilots Association



And finally:


August 14, 2009
Pilot Union Response to Failed Frontier Bid (DALLAS) Statement of Attribution to Capt. Carl Kuwitzky, SWAPA President Media Note: Please use this statement in lieu of interviews. “We have received notice of the bankruptcy court’s decision to not award Southwest Airlines with the acquisition of Frontier Holdings. It appears, as we suspected, that the lack of an agreement between the two pilots unions on an integration plan caused the court to not deem the Southwest Airlines bid as qualified. However, it should be noted that Frontier also said that Republic’s bid was the “highest and best.” So it wasn’t solely about labor. First and foremost, we wish the best of luck to the current Frontier Airlines pilots. We felt they would have been a good fit for our culture and operation. The offer that we presented FAPA representatives on Wednesday night addressed three of their four stated needs; allowing pay protections for their pilots which would have given roughly a 40 percent raise for their First Officers, providing domicile protection for their Denver-based pilots, and guaranteeing that all of their 650+ pilots would be placed on our seniority list including their furloughed pilots. While they chose to not entertain placing their seniority list below ours, we felt protecting their pay and home domicile while providing a job security was an extremely fair offer. In the end, the Frontier bankruptcy lawyers allowed only a few hours to negotiate an integration agreement that historically takes months or years to accomplish. Next, we are thankful to work with a company that in this instance chose to put employee relations ahead of all other priorities. Southwest Airlines chose to include a labor contingency in their bid for Frontier Airlines. That contingency guaranteed no drawn-out labor integration battle that is seen in so many other mergers and acquisitions. They felt that having happy and satisfied employees, on both the SWA and Frontier sides was paramount to a successful deal and a successful airline. We applaud that mindset. SWAPA encourages the Company to maintain that successful labor relations mindset while working with us to swiftly complete negotiations on our 15-year-old contract.”

All Republic Pilots should take note of FAPA's representation of its pilots, and once again as I have said numerous times, I am a student of history- and it often repeats itself.

Dan Sneddon
Capt. Republic Airlines

FAULTPUSH

Carl Kuwitzky had it right. Without a staple, it will be a long process for Air Tran and SWA.

But I'm still at a loss for why you think these letters help your case. There's very few pilots at Frontier who felt (or feel) that turning down a staple job with SWA was a bad thing, especially now that Air Tran will get an equitable integration (unless ALPA throws them under the bus like they did to TWA).

ToiletDuck

He's asking where the documentation is that supports the RPC claims and if they've filed the proper paperwork with govt. It's a simple question. I've asked even on the RPC site and all I did was get a sales pitch.