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-   -   Persona non grata (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/union-talk/70440-persona-non-grata.html)

Hetman 10-06-2012 08:55 AM

Persona non grata
 
I recenty withdrew my union membership in favor of objecting non member status. The reason is unimportant to anyone but me, but was not based on any incident or conflict with the LEC. Personal reasons. That being said, I am aware of both my forfeitures and rights regarding this decision. Although I am no longer a member of the union, I remain a member of the bargaining unit. I continue to pay my share of the costs of collective bargaining, contract administration and grievance administration and the bargaining agent remains responsible to me for these services.

My access to the union website and forums has been removed due to my non-member status. Understandable, but both those are resources necessary for me to avail myself of the services for which my association fee pays and as such, the rights I retain as a fee payer. The LEC uses both to communicate with the pilots regarding contract issues and the union website contains links to the grievance committee, grievance form and grievance progress reports. A request to have the resources reinstated has gone unanswered.

Here is my question: Am I being denied rights as a member of the bargaining unit due to my inability to access these resources?

TonyC 10-06-2012 10:02 AM


Originally Posted by Hetman (Post 1272489)

Although I am no longer a member of the union, I remain a member of the bargaining unit.

...

Here is my question: Am I being denied rights as a member of the bargaining unit due to my inability to access these resources?


You don't want to be a member, but you still call yourself a member?

You're confused.

Being part of the bargaining unit simply means you are part of the class or craft that the collective bargaining agent, the union, must represent. In other words, you're a pilot. The bargaining unit exists regardless of whether or not there is a union. Just being a pilot entitles you to nothing.

The collective bargaining agent, the union, only has a responsibility to represent you with regards to your Collective Bargaining Agreement. Period. They have no obligation to communicate to you about anything else whatsoever, nor to make any other resources available to you.

You'll enjoy all of the benefits which are bargained for your class or craft (work rules, pay rates, etc.) through collective bargaining, and you will receive representation if the employer attempts to discipline you, and you may receive representation if you have a valid grievance against your employer. Other than that, you're on your own.

It's your choice. Enjoy your personal copy of the CBA.






.

Hetman 10-06-2012 08:10 PM

Thanks for the quick reply. I figured that was the case and was not surprised at the "ACCESS DENIED." There are workarounds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8Jor8tPs&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Snarge 10-06-2012 09:01 PM


Originally Posted by Hetman (Post 1272489)
I recenty withdrew my union membership in favor of objecting non member status. The reason is unimportant to anyone but me,

usually money, but not alway$

fireman0174 10-07-2012 04:16 AM


Originally Posted by TonyC (Post 1272533)
. . . . and you will receive representation if the employer attempts to discipline you, and you may receive representation if you have a valid grievance against your employer. Other than that, you're on your own.
.

Unless things have changed, under these circumstances I believe the bargaining unit has the right to present a bill for the grievance representation expenses.

Baxter 10-07-2012 08:32 AM

Naw, I don't think that's right. Sure, they can send a bill, but he won't have to pay it. That's what the association fee is for.

TonyC 10-07-2012 09:26 AM


Originally Posted by fireman0174 (Post 1272837)

Unless things have changed, under these circumstances I believe the bargaining unit has the right to present a bill for the grievance representation expenses.


The Collective Bargaining Agent has the duty to provide the same level of representation to all members of the class, be they members or not. If they send members a bill, they can send non-members a bill. I don't know of any that send members a bill. The cost of the service is included in the dues or contract maintenance fee structure.







.

RedeyeAV8r 10-08-2012 03:37 AM


Originally Posted by TonyC (Post 1272918)
The Collective Bargaining Agent has the duty to provide the same level of representation to all members of the class, be they members or not. If they send members a bill, they can send non-members a bill. I don't know of any that send members a bill. The cost of the service is included in the dues or contract maintenance fee structure..


Tony, I am not 100% sure, but I do not believe that the Association (ALPA in our case) is legally required to a provide a legal defense in the case of discipline. I believe that ALPA is only required to see that a member of the Kraft and Class gets "due process" under Section 19,20 and 21 (of Our Contract). You are correct that under the DFR, ALPA must provide the same benefits to all members of the Kraft and Class regardless of their Union membership status.

Now as far as I know, ALPA has never refused to provide a legal defense in a Severe Disciplinary case. Mostly because it is the right thing to do, but it probably has more to do with the Legal precedent that could/would be set by not defending a crew-member in future cases. Again, I am not sure on this point but I think ALPA could bill a pilot for an excessive legal defense if they chose to, but again I do not know of a case where this has happened, nor do I think they would as this would also set a precedent.

Hopefully someone who really knows can set the record straight on this.

As we have seen recently, Pilots are Free to hire their own outside Legal Counsel (at their own expense) to handle their individual disciplinary cases.


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