MasterOfPuppets

Yeah a few years ago......not sure why that's relevant though.

AWAX I realized your response was sarcastic unfortunantly Ol' Buscappy 100% lives by what you wrote.

bigfatdaddy

...........very nice

buscappy

sarcastic or not, I still agree with your post

anyway, the bottom 20% can whine all they want. the upper 60-80% will always win the votes. always been that way..
the good news is - the list changes as folks grow older..

Boeing Aviator

My memory isn't the greatest but the following is what I recall the reason given when I talked to a Rep right after the MEC meeting where they received the briefing from the CROC (crew rest oversight committee).

Overall size
Width of bed
Crew rest seat in bunk area
Space available to stand
Changing area

Cost to modify crew rest area too expensive and Airbus refuses to modify.

Again this is from my memory, I may have missed something or made an error. What I can tell you that I remember perfectly clear. The management counterparts of the CROC committee that traveled with them to study the 350 crew rest area was 100% in agreement with ALPA that the 350 crew rest area wasn't 117 compliant.

buscappy

and, awax, if your post was attempted sarcasm - it's even worse. then it's just another post whining about being junior - and vacations and schedules and reserve. (and training, really? a couple days a year at a difference of an hour or two a day? you sit around your pad whining about a couple hundred bucks? what a joyless life you must lead)
about your main "sarcastic" whines though. yes. when a pilot is junior (in seat/equip/base) that pilot will be on reserve and need to be available to cover trips, or will have crappy schedules, and maybe get crappy vacation allotments. that's how seniority systems work.
so i guess you can just whine away until another thou or so retire, then you can join the middle seniority ranks and relax ...

oldmako

The longer I fly airplanes the more I look forward to retirement and saying adios to some of my fellow pilots.

The "I got mine, eff you" crowd.

After buying all my tickets and after spending 15 years of mucking stalls in the Part 135 and commuter world I finally got this job at 40. I was the second oldest and most junior guy in my class. I fully understood and accepted the seniority system WRT bidding, seats, equipment, domicile, trips, vaca, etc etc. I was elated. Bring forth the filth, I can handle it.

What I cannot understand, and will never accept is the guys in the catbird seat so anxious to open their puckered round smelly bomb bay and gleefully remind me just what my lot in life is as a career junior maggot. This, as opposed to what it could be with a mere scintilla of foresight and effort to improve the contract for all without the massive pay cut they insist would follow.

How many super senior F/O's avoid upgrade (and all the extra money and fluffery it entails) simply because being junior in ANY seat has its drawbacks? In a pilot group of 12,000 I'd say quite a few. Esprit de Corps has departed the fix forever.

This isn't rocket surgery, yet many insist that it must be, so therefore it always will be.

awax

I like that!

awax

Being the bastard stepchild of sarcasm today, I fully expect the beatdown for asking, but:

Is "Esprit de Corps has departed the fix forever" akin to "misery loves company" in that being junior builds a certain character across the airline as everyone gets a bite of the same poop sandwich?

Aren't those widebody FOs and narrow body Captains entitled to the rightful expression of seniority? Whatever the reason for sandbagging in a seat, I believe that's the benefit of having the seniority to do so. No matter how the pilot demographic is shuffled, the clear majority of pilots will fit under the bell curve somewhere between - being above the gline and unable to hold christmas vacation. I'd suggest that's the true shared experience. Except for new hires, being junior is a choice.

That said, there are number of changes needed to improve the QOL for those scraping the dregs in a BES (by the grace of God go I, huh?). In that regard, I don't think that the Esprit de Corps has gone anywhere. I suppose we'll see on Section 6 openers.

awax

That you took time to reply twice, and neither reply really made sense is absolutely precious. Stay gold, Ponyboy.

oldmako

ajax,

Seniority is everything. Been living it for 31 years and I wouldn't have it any other way. But when "rightful expression of seniority" is someone gloating for sport while sporting a raised middle digit it tends to get my dander up. Particularly those who got hired at 23 or 24 and made it to the left seat in 3 or 4 years, and then spent the last 15 as Wide Body Captains. And, the guys who got the windfall of age 65 while I and my classmates got sent packing. Both groups just got lucky. They don't have any magic juju that any other new hire lacks, yet they seem to think that their digestive residue has a pleasing odor. Those are the dudes I won't miss. I submit that The Lost Decade crowd understands what no seniority means better than most. We don't need to be reminded of it, nor reprimanded for the lack of it.

My mentors were guys who spent 15 years on the panel, so I understand just how good I have had it. But those same guys understood how lopsided this gig is and how, with just a few minor changes we could improve it for everyone, from DOH to DOR. For example, I paid for housing during new hire training. That was idiotic and I'd be glad to do my part to ensure that new hires don't have to.
That's just one small example. Seems like UA has morphed into one big "what's in it for ME" group now, and I find that unseemly.

Mine is a pointless (female dog) I know. And if I didn't someone will surely remind me.