Originally Posted by Sunvox

No but Southwest, Kiwi, Vanguard, Spirit, Frontier, and others were around, and I did not and would never have applied to any. In fact I was called at home and offered a job at Vanguard while I was flying a 1900 and turned it down. I would have gotten to United a year earlier had I taken the job, but I'm a bit of a utopian and altruist at heart, and I believed then as I do now that pilots should not fly jets for non-mainline companies. I actually had applications in for investment jobs in '96 when I finally got hired at UAL because I promised myself if I didn't make it to the mainlines by 30 I'd look for work elsewhere rather than go to work for a non-mainline jet company. Lucky for me, United called 3 months before I turned 30.

Originally Posted by SUX4U

Tell us more about how United pilots sold scope out and what their pay rates were after selling out? Speaking of scope sell out, aren’t you flying for the carrier with the absolute weakest scope language that came with new increased pay rates?

Originally Posted by aviatormjc

How did Vanguard get your home phone number is you never applied there?

So your concern for mainline pilots almost drove you into banking because in a perfect world all flying would be done by mainline?



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Originally Posted by Sunvox

First of all they don't post that statistic. Second of all it would still be a minor fraction especially when considered on a company by company basis. Your post has no factual basis, but yet you post and people who sympathize with your sentiment shake their head in agreement and the myth continues. Regionals represent a small piece of the pie and to think otherwise is simply not factual.

I am not trying to say mainline pilots are better than regional pilots. What I am trying to show with a simple factual chart is that regional flying is a small piece of the total flying especially when considered on a company by company basis, and what is worse is that the mainline companies have simply ravaged the regionals every few years to get the lowest cost possible for this feed.

When I was 23 I vowed I would never fly a jet for a non-mainline carrier. I got hired off a Beech 1900. If every pilot had the same opinion as mine regionals would never have had a place in history. I don't expect my Utopian view to be popular, but I just hope regional pilots of today can empathize a little better with mainline pilots. No one foresaw 9/11 or age 65 or the financial collapse of 2008 and THAT is really what enabled the 50 seaters and then the 70 seaters to proverbially Take Off. Today we should all be focused on reversing that trend regardless of where we work.

Originally Posted by Dexter

Gosh,

If only there was a way to find information on the internet. . .

https://www.transtats.bts.gov/Data_Elements.aspx?Data=2

Originally Posted by CRJ1988

What about selling out your own union brothers and sisters? 2172 UAL pilots were put on the street in 03. Roughly 1400 furloughed in 08-09. Had scope not originally be relaxed in 1997 then again in 2003, wouldn’t the large RJs have been flown my pilots on the mainline list? Couldn’t United have been saved in 2003 without caving on scope?

Originally Posted by Varsity

Are you serious?

The only people to blame for RJ's existing is the mainline pilots who sold out scope to keep a few more dollars in their paycheck.

There is no shortage of people wanting to fly for a living. Regionals have classes full until next year. It you create it, it will get staffed.

The only people creating this mess of a system are the greedy mainline pilots saying "eff the scum below me, I got mine." Now there are a few realizing the heavy intl flying is getting farmed out to JV's at the top and the regional jet flying is getting bigger at the bottom saying "oh no guys! let's band together now that my future wb job might be at risk!"

Originally Posted by CRJ1988

What about selling out your own union brothers and sisters? 2172 UAL pilots were put on the street in 03. Roughly 1400 furloughed in 08-09. Had scope not originally be relaxed in 1997 then again in 2003, wouldn’t the large RJs have been flown my pilots on the mainline list? Couldn’t United have been saved in 2003 without caving on scope?

Originally Posted by baseball

Preach on my BROTHER!

Teach it and Preach it.

Each and every time there has been "scope relief" it caused two things to happen:

1. Provided only temporary financial relief to the airline. Why? Because the competion figures out a way to adapt.

2. Provided a permanent Screw Job to the pilots at the airline and to the profession at large.


The LOST DECADE in aviation was caused by "scope relief." If Joe Pilot wants to know why he had to fly an RJ around for garbage wages for 15 years, there's his answer....

Today's Jeopardy challenge Topic "scope relief." Shall we come up with some clever answers and provide the questions for today's Jeopardy Challenge?

I'll take Airline Flying for 200 Alex

1. The upcoming pilot shortage in America as well as stagnant wages, and poor career progression and reduced career expectations was the result of. What is "Scope Relief?"