HAL vs UA
 

Any ex - HAL that can give their comparisons on both places?

What made you pull the plug? Happy? Regrets?

Where do you live? That’s the only question that matters in that comparison.

True. Live on island now with a view that we’ll prob end up on the mainland and commute in the future until at least can hold a widebody left seat (7-10ys). Don’t have anything against the islands but no family ties, will always be an outsider and it’s very expensive. Schooling will be an issue down the road, can be mitigated by private school however.

Just looking for an comments from people that have left as I don’t know anyone, not whole helluva lot of people decide to leave HAL, especially after 5+ years.

Am I reading correctly you anticipate coming over here & holding WB CA in 7-10 years? If so, I’d call that extremely optimistic. Or are you saying that’s how long it will take you to upgrade at your current airline?

Currently @HAL. Been several that left for United and wanted some feedback on how the properties compare.

looks like west coast 756 CA in 12 years. 777 CA FO in 18 years at UA.

I’ve long been banging this drum, but years are a terrible indicator of how long it takes to do something because hiring is not a constant flow. There are times where a few hundred seniority numbers represent a decade’s disparity in hiring numbers, vs today where a single year will span a couple thousand. Jr. WB CA here is presently around 35%. Assuming all other factors remain the same, the amount of time it takes someone to reach that percentage varies greatly based on their hire date.

Having said that, it’s still not entirely clear to me whether he’s talking about upgrading at HAL or UAL, & what exactly he’s thinking about doing with commuting, but I’d agree with the above that location should probably be the primary consideration. Of everything one might be weighing, wanting to live in HI would be the biggest strike against coming to UAL by far. After that, you’d have to do your own calculus on relative career progression against pre-retirement years remaining. Work rules would probably be the lowest consideration, but hopefully someone who’s done both can sound off on that…

Read my posts again. Don’t care about upgrade, don’t particularly want to live in Hawaii. Simply interested in people that have worked at both places and if they are happier there. Work rules, company culture, contract etc.

Well- given what you have said, I’d say United might be an excellent choice for you. You will make more money and outside of HAL, nobody flies more passengers to Hawaii than UAL therefore you can still spend time there but “just pass through” without the headache of living there. Culture here is positive and the crews are great. West Coast bases if that is where you want to be. Lots of growth planned so good timing I’d say.

Thanks. *filler

I can connect you with a pilot I know that did what you are contemplating in very early 2001.....then furloughed from UAL for 1/2 decade, then returned to UAL for 737 west coast, then refurloughed from UAL and said f-it and got rehired by HAL (minus 10yrs seniority).....

Just be aware that every time you jump ship you are reintroducing the risk of the economy burping, demand drying up and going from pilot shortage to pilot overage in short order.

Think I’ve flown with the guy. Definitely a consideration.

I left a purple tailed cargo outfit to come to United. DO NOT REGRET FOR A MINUTE! Even during the COVID mess…. In fact, reinforced why I left.

Admittedly it’s “apples to pineapples”…. But I feel the company, the culture and the direction long-term that UAL is headed is better than anywhere else.

You mean the full blown, unleashed wokeness by Kirby, taking hard core stances, aiming to hire half of new pilots purely based on race, sex and national origin, and not the most qualified? Yup, you made the right decision. Excellent company culture.

You must be one of those millennial types that are a bundle of joy to fly with.

Shots fired!

So how’d that United interview go?

Point of order: Although many of us roll our eyes at some of the ivory tower initiatives, a little clarification is in order on this point. The 50% number is the number Kirby would like to see starting at the Aviate academy. It would correlate to a small % on the line in a best case scenario, assuming everyone makes it all the way to United, because the Aviate grads are only one small part of the total hiring pie. Not apologizing for some of our woke nonsense, just wanted to clear up a common misconception. (I had it too)

And a huge percentage of those that fall into the minority category don't have the resources to pay for flight training. While the 50% number would be nice, its not realistically attainable. The money that is earmarked towards helping Aviate students pay for their training comes to about $2500 per person, which we all know is a drop in the bucket when it comes to paying for their ratings.

But its more fun to caterwaul about those darn minorities taking our jerbs, so disregard what I posted above.

I flew with a guy who was at Hal for ten years and came here. He said he doesn't regret it, especially as WN begins inter island flying in direct competition.

YMMV

You nailed it. When the flight deck door closes (NOT cockpit - that's sexist), I go full blown ooff on my FOs and lecture them about how important CRT and LGBTQXYZ+++ stuff is. And if it's a white dude halfwinger, I tell him he's paying for everything on this trip because he owes me. :rolleyes:

Now, let's get real. Just about every company is doing the woke thing right now because they face a lot of pressure from left wingnuts (paging ooff). United has played along with all of that because someone in marketing said it's good business. I don't know and I don't care. I'm in the cockpit with the FO during almost all of my time in uniform. Mostly halfwingers because I fly fifi in a very junior coastal base. They're all very good; it's the rare exception that I have someone who's only average. And ironically, almost all of them are white males. The few females and minorities that I fly with are excellent pilots and are every bit as (or more) qualified as the usual white guy FO.

I understand your complaint about the company's wokeness but it's not something that dominates the culture.
I understand your persecution complex because you're a white guy but all one needs to do is look at newhire class photos and realize that they look like loaves of wonder bread.

All the best to you in your career; try to downsize that chip on your shoulder.

SD3FR8DOG, sorry for jumping on your thread. No matter what you decide to do, you can't go wrong. All the best.

I guess you could not deduct from my username that I am hispanic and very brown. Especially being in this demographic, I do not want nor deserve any special consideration. Let the guy/gal most qualified get the job without stupid quotas. And I am so glad to be working for a company that is not nearly as woke, wouldn’t touch United with a 10 ft pole.

well then I’m glad we don’t have you then, you seem like a true gem.

That's awesome that you've ruled out United. You work for Netjets and are searching for a job at UPS/FedEx/Delta/AA, right? They're all 'woke'. Get used to it.

Nahhh. Left NJ a while ago, slave ship, I have by far the best job in aviation, something to do with Purple tails. Talk about an anti woke company 👍.

... and yet, you posted this on Delta's board just two months ago:

​​​​​​
Please go play somewhere else.

Funny how “offended your tough - and I’m just repeating how you said you had “brown skin” gets when someone shares a personal experience” And I’m neither millennial nor female or gay either for that matter - so your attempt to hurt me failed miserably. I laugh in your general direction mate.

Maybe you got hired at purple because the color of your skin and NOT because you were the most qualified??? Just a thought….


yeah playa - your argument just backfired!

On the other hand his mention of purple tails tracks with my experience. The most backwards stuff I've heard has been from there.

DM Sent

filler

The covid mess reinforced why you left? I seriously doubt you were sitting there in 2020 thinking "thank god I left purple for UA, I wouldn't be getting this sweet WARN letter in the mail if I hadn't" or "Damn, I'm so glad I left purple for a company that might not actually make it through this without some serious pain."

If you had been at Purple during 2020 your income would have been over a half million more since the time you left. It's not all about money, but that's still nothing to brush off either.

It’s funny how you purple dudes are soo sensitive and yet seem to always be browsing the passenger forums…

Let me ask you….how many of your coworkers have been out on some sort of medical since the beginning of 2020? Because I know of at least 5/6 guys from my BI class at FDX having had medical issues since I’ve left. Anecdotal? Sure, but it’s something to consider…. And I’ve heard all the stories of guys making “huge money” during the lockdown. Cool bro.

The cultures between the two are so different, it is honestly a bit strange that people argue which is better. If you like life at purple, you honestly would probably dislike UAL.

Taking care of passengers, meeting and listening to FAs with bizarre life experiences, flying with pilots who have different opinions than yours, not banking on drinking away most overnights with your flying partner, working more than 14 days a month and not making a min of 250k a year…. They have evolved into pretty different jobs.

Hard to say one is better

I literally know 0 people at purple who are out on medical leave since beginning of 2020. how's that for anecdotal evidence?

We browse this forum because the future of your AIP and possible TA will likely impact ours. I called you out because you seem really insecure about your decision to leave purple and you're projecting that feeling through your posts about how much happier you are to be at UAL and how "awful" purple was.

UAL is a great job. Purple is a great job. A level headed person could find their happy place at either one... but saying that you were so stoked to be at UAL through 2020 instead of staying at purple... we can all see through that.

Hal is a great place to work if you live in Hawaii.
If you don't, its not worth it. Pay and work rules will always be inferior to the legacies.

you can see what? That I spoke my personal truth, and that for some reason triggered you into responding in a very non cool way back attacking me and assuming you know me or “see through me” via the interweb, with your special purple goggles? Eh? What ever …. Go back to your sleep room and get ready for your 2:39am departure for Omaha, or whatever….