Engineering Pilot Interviews
 

Rumor has it all the Engineering Test Pilots have to re-interview for their jobs.
Manager is Selwyn Laughter. Suggest interested pilots contact him (UAL INDEG) directly.

These are pilots not on the pilot seniority list or over age 60/65? Covered by a CBA or separate employment with the company?

Not on seniority list and under separate employment with the company.

As far as I'm concerned, these should be seniority list jobs and if not I know ~1400 UA pilots who could easily ferry aircraft to/from MX and the paint shops.

Amen...........bump

That's what I thought, so personally not going to shed a tear for them because they have to reinterview or might be out of a job.

[QUOTE=cadetdrivr;993964

As far as I'm concerned, these should be seniority list jobs and if not I know ~1400 UA pilots who could easily ferry aircraft to/from MX and the paint shops.[/QUOTE]

We used to do that anyway on reserve.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but engineering test pilots can fly past 65. Why? because the test flights are operated under FAR Part 91, not 121. No age limit, just Insurance limits.

I did a ferry from GLH two weeks ago and there was also a UAL crew with us to bring a newly painted 320 to ORD. The CA said he was a regular line holder and the FO was a DCA reserve. What exactly do the other pilots do and how many of them are there?

We have pilots something along those lines at CAL. We call them the "gummers", they aren't on the seniority list and are over 60 at least. Maybe we can get rid of both groups. F'n retire you old bastards.

Whether you agree or disagree the position of UAL Test Pilots, the important take away from this is not ones pleasure in watching an employee group squirm for their job. The important take away is why are they being asked to reinterview for their job? Could this tactic be utilized against other employee groups?

Engineering test pilots do a lot more than ferry airplanes. I know a guy who left the line to go do it and he was a TPS graduate. He told me that was a requirement.

I don't know that for sure but I know these guys do a lot of the rigging flights and stall series and other stuff required after heavy maintenance and certain other events.

Thought mx ferry and paint shop flights were done by line pilots. Unless it has changed we used to run them to new iberia and gso for both. I don't think that is what test pilots do, like I said unless something has changed.

A good friend of my family is a retired Engineering Test Pilot for UAL. I can assure you that they do a lot more than ferry perfectly good aircraft. They all have extensive test pilot experience and do things that most line guys would rightly refuse to do, like three engine ferries of 747's, initial acceptance flights of new aircraft, etc. UAL is the only U.S. carrier left that has it's own cadre of test pilots, and in my opinion we should be grateful for them. I, for one, have no interest in doing the type of flying that they do. As an aside, my retired friend spent an inordinate amount of time at TK in order to stay current in all the aircraft that he is typed in (everything UAL ever flew from the DC-3 to the 747)

As someone on furlough, I don't want the engineering test pilots jobs. I am always concerned when the company makes a group of pilots reinterview for their jobs!

That sounds like a set up to me.

FMT

Should be ALPA flying
 

News Flash, nothing EG pilots do requires being a TPS graduate. Requirement is just a barrier to entry to prevent ALPA line holders for doing flying that should be theirs.
How many of you would like to fly past 65? Get a bonus of over $40,000 this year?
Apply for the position, they make way more than you do and work less.....

Thinking the same thing, it could be like a FCF qual back in the military. It could be run like our LCA program or a TAD monthly bid.

They do not "work less."

They may fly less, but they're constantly in the training center here at the old DEN staying current, and when they do fly, they fly on an entire different level than most others. Like ReserveDog said, stuff like ferrying 747s with only 3 engines happens more than you would think. My neighbor was an Engineering Pilot before he got a line, and has some wild stories.

News flash!! Nothing a physician does requires a medical degree. The degree simply organizes the idea that one can provide an alternative method that is by far more humane...:cool:

So are you saying that it takes a higher level of training to do stupid $hit?:)

Ok Lets talk Qualifications
 

Lets see:
1. Engineering pilots do wiffer dill over SFO in a 737, almost losing the aircraft. Captain is still flying for UAL.

2. Paul Skabo and Dave Peterson depressurize A320 at altitude trying to "trouble shoot" a problem. Mx Technician is out on permanent disability because of their actions. Peterson is well over 65 and still on the payroll.

As to time at TK, maybe 2 PCs a year, they only have to do one in type every two years.

Engine out ferries are purely for cost savings, no operational need to do them. Once you park the 400's that will be the end of those.

As to the neighbors etc that were in EG, of course they are loyal to EG. Neither one of them would have been competitive for a UAL interview if they hadn't been given their FE ticket and 737/A320 FO checkouts at UAL expense.

BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THEY ARE DOING WHAT SHOULD BE ALPA FLYING.

ALPA SHOULD WELCOME THE EG PILOTS INTO THE UNION, A WIN WIN SOLUTION

Now Come ON!! You and I BOTH know Line pilots are NOT going to test fly anyrhing!!
You've NEVER assisted Maintenence in troubleshooting before and you're NOT going up to test airplanes coming out of maintenence or help Maintenence nail down problems or fly gear down ferries or test flights for horizontal stabilizer trim motor changes nor double engine changes. So WHY don't we quit the blather? Because I'll bet $50.00 the FIRST time I offer it? The FODM will fall over DEAD! You'd Never get the chance to even TRY! If you can refuse an airplane being ferried for lightning strike repairs with NO restrictions?? Are you Kidding me?

You gets what you pay for.

More bluster.

Perhaps I can relate a little story to you which may shed some light on why we don't voluntarily do idiotic crap for maint.

Ten years ago I was a relatively new hire on the 67 fleet. I was bumped from the 27 after they were parked. As a reserve maggot I got to fly a lot of junk that other guys didn't want to do.

Deadheaded to TPA to fly a maintenance verification flight. The plane had been there for days with a dicked up slat. While standing in ops the guy behind the counter tells me that we are going to take the plane up, and if still dicked up, we will fly it to MIA. "Sure, whatever" is my reply. I had been a long time commuter maggot and we did this type of crap all the time.

The Captain shows up and I tell him what's up. He looks at me and says, "No, we're not" and asks me to go and grab my FOM. He then walks over and tells the ops guy that we're not taking that plane to MIA. OPS guy is pi$$ed and cops an attitude.

Captain refers me to the maint chap and asks me to read exactly what we were authorized to do under the auspices of the FOM, and the specific flight / release we had been issued.

It clearly forbade us from doing anything outside "normal ops" with the plane. It also forbade us from turning a maintenance verification flight into a maintenance ferry flight.

So....there ya go.

There are usually specific reasons why pilots don't do certain crap with the plane. And there is plenty of uninformed opinion, bit@hing and hand wringing when we don't.

I will not risk my life or license for UAL.

I used to fly for ATI. We had three guys killed attempting a three engine take off for a maintenance ferry. I've done gear down ferry flights, non pressurized ferry flights maintenance verification and test flights for other companies.

It's just not worth it to me. There are more than a fair share of crashes due to the unusual stuff that happens on these flights and lets face it other than the sim once a year we NEVER get to practice this stuff in real life. How often have any of you guys taken an airliner to the shaker or auto throttle wake up or alpha lock? Hopefully never.

The engineering guys are an asset plain and simple. They should have an ALPA number and a seniority number.

A good chunk of the pilot group has experience doing those or similar things as post maintenance check flight pilots. Yes, it's a PITA and would require a specific qual and training, but there are plenty of pilots on our list who have experience doing similar flights, and some would do it again if the price was right.

Exactly.