APC225

How about "halfway to a contract" game? The company guesses when the on time stat gets halfway to zero. The winner gets to bargain in good faith.

LeeFXDWG

Nice,

But you gave me a flashback to being a DC-10 engineer!

Ah, sitting sideways, but ORD to HNL was a blast. Guess the halfway game kept me awake for a short time!

Lee

AuzCap

Why are we still doing this? Channel 9 off... Halfway to Hawaii... I don't think so. Engine maintenance runs at the gate... Not likely. Show me a contract, then ask me to do all the extra crap they expect us to do for free...

SoCentralRain

You get paid for engine runs to the tune of 15 minutes. (yay.)

SCR

APC225

Engine runs are serious business. There have been more than one injured/killed by them at CAL. For this reason they require approval and conference call with captain and senior mx and senior ops managers beforehand, followed by written approval.

In getting this approval, I have heard some captains have taken this responsibility so seriously that they have negotiated, on the spot, for pay that covers the entire period they are on duty for this work, from start of first engine run, through all the starts and stops if there are any, to the final shutdown.

They have asked for this pay guarantee to be put in writing right on the required written approval for the engine run itself. When the managers balk, the captain has just said, "you can reach me at the hotel." With no one else to run the engine at an out station, the managers have approved it. After payroll denies the payclaim and bumps it over the to the CP, it has been paid once this written approval is seen.

Or, so I have heard.

You get what you negotiate.

throttleweenie

You get paid if you make them pay you, otherwise, it's out of the goodness of your heart.

I did one, three years ago, and told the Flight Ops duty Manager that I'd do it as soon as I saw the printer spit out a thing saying I'd get paid. That's the last time I'll ever do one, contract or not.

Last month, I refused one, which caused a delay, late arrival, illegal layover, deadhead v. fly the next day. I got a call from the Ass't Chief Pilot the next day. He told me they pay us for engine runs. I told him it's not contractually required so I don't do them.

They've lost me.

Simple as that.

TW

syd111

So you think we should negotiate individually for these things? Kind of like negotiating with the crew desk for more individual pay when legalities arrive?

APC225

Not legalities, ever. And it is sad that the abuse gets to such a level that individuals are put in a position of actually negotiating one-on-one, as grievances seem to go nowhere and the contract doesn't protect the pilot.

But it's nice to hear that some captains have actually said "enough" on some the QOL and pay issues, like the engine runs, and told them to pay fairly for work done. 15 minutes of pay for an engine run? It takes 30 minutes just to get the conference call and authorization paperwork done. He should have been in the hotel by now.