SLI June 18th
06-25-2013, 06:28 PM
#201
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2012
Posts: 152
Originally Posted by ChrisJT6
Yeah right...CAL was so SHot that they were the only legacy carrier or major for that that hired big during the worst recession in 80 years...youre right...your product was so great you went from furloughing and loosing money and then all of the sudden come spring 2010 your SHot plan that in your world had nothing to do with the merger kicked in. The merger had nothing to do with your radically industry odd hiring and turnaround. Give me a break.
Why is it that CAL pilots are the only ones in the world that believe this ridiculous slime.
Why is it that CAL pilots are the only ones in the world that believe this ridiculous slime.
We really didn't have to furlough, no reason for that.
Ridiculous slime, that's pretty funny. You know slime can be found everywhere.
06-25-2013, 06:33 PM
#202
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Joined APC: Mar 2012
Posts: 152
Originally Posted by Scott Stoops
One day after the merger? Are you kidding me? Plans were in place far before that.
Pre-merger CAL fleet size is identical to post merger fleet size. You simply increased utilization of the 737's (roughly 3-5 Airbus, 757, 767 in paint each month) in UAL bases. Virtually all of the remaining 320's (my fleet, so that's what I paid attention to) became East Coast CAL EWR, CLE, and IAH machines. Totally decimated our flying. Horrible changes, while CAL pilots accepted positions in our most senior domicile (DEN). In trade, spots for the 320 went unfilled in your domiciles.
On the iPads, I agree! Blame Joe Burns (legacy UAL fella). On the rest, I think there is plenty of blame that can be applied to both sides for the lack of integration focus...
Scott
Pre-merger CAL fleet size is identical to post merger fleet size. You simply increased utilization of the 737's (roughly 3-5 Airbus, 757, 767 in paint each month) in UAL bases. Virtually all of the remaining 320's (my fleet, so that's what I paid attention to) became East Coast CAL EWR, CLE, and IAH machines. Totally decimated our flying. Horrible changes, while CAL pilots accepted positions in our most senior domicile (DEN). In trade, spots for the 320 went unfilled in your domiciles.
On the iPads, I agree! Blame Joe Burns (legacy UAL fella). On the rest, I think there is plenty of blame that can be applied to both sides for the lack of integration focus...
Scott
anyway 1-2 months and we have an ISL, look forward to this phase of the merger being over!
06-25-2013, 07:50 PM
#203
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Joined APC: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,083
Originally Posted by routemap
The arbitrators laughed really? We had growth, it was coming merger or not. We also had a Transition agreement. It set block hours on both sides of the fence. All you see are airplanes in your hubs, hmm there are UAL airplanes in our hubs too.
-We don't think other considerations should be used, we know they should! ALPA merger policy allows it and we have strong reasons to do so.
-We didn't block you from anything, all you had to do to bid the equipment was get hired at CAL. You see that was CAL flying prior to the merger. Airplanes ordered prior to the merger.
At this time, I am pretty embarrassed being a United pilot. Hope that changes.
-We don't think other considerations should be used, we know they should! ALPA merger policy allows it and we have strong reasons to do so.
-We didn't block you from anything, all you had to do to bid the equipment was get hired at CAL. You see that was CAL flying prior to the merger. Airplanes ordered prior to the merger.
At this time, I am pretty embarrassed being a United pilot. Hope that changes.
06-26-2013, 06:02 AM
#204
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Joined APC: Nov 2010
Position: 737 Cap
Posts: 451
Originally Posted by texaspilot76
If there is no mutual agreement, and this goes to the binding arbitration under the McCaskill and Bond, when do you expect a list to complete? Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it true that if a ruling is made under the MB law it is final and binding, no whining, lawsuits, de-certifying ALPA, etc.?
This cannot possibly be arbitrated under McCaskill. This is an ALPA dispute (i.e. both ALPA carriers). There is a full merger integration agreement between both sides of the dispute signed by all relevant parties that outlines the process, chose the arbitrators, and set the timelines. The outcome of the arbitration will be applied. I expect that will occur mid-late August.
Speaking to lawsuits, etc... those would be individuals or groups of individuals. I suspect that will occur, and that they will be unsuccessful. The list will stand, we will be integrated, and hopefully we'll all feel wronged just a little bit.
On de-cert, there is nothing stopping any group from attempting to change representation. Going on right now at Delta. It wouldn't stop the UCH list from being implemented, however. I expect ALPA National will certify and push the list to United very quickly in this case.
To finish your line of outcomes that wouldn't be allowed, we can also all whine as much as we like. Not that anyone will care.
Scott
06-26-2013, 06:32 AM
#205
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Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 840
I can't believe people are still arguing over which airline was the crappiest..??? Who care's. They both sucked for different reasons. Act like college educated people and discuss things that matter. On that, we've got to get the 2 pilot cultures to blend at some point so we can get things done when we need to. This means that we'll all have to give and take a little bit.
I can tell you I am probably the most awful negotiator you'll ever meet. I want what I want and I'd rather negotiate with my knee in your chest and knife at your throat. But, this pilot group can't do that with each other as we have to work together for a long time and nothing will be gained by it. Give each other a little slack and listen twice as much as you talk. Hopefully, we can make the place a fun environment in the future.
I can tell you I am probably the most awful negotiator you'll ever meet. I want what I want and I'd rather negotiate with my knee in your chest and knife at your throat. But, this pilot group can't do that with each other as we have to work together for a long time and nothing will be gained by it. Give each other a little slack and listen twice as much as you talk. Hopefully, we can make the place a fun environment in the future.
06-26-2013, 07:54 AM
#206
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2010
Position: 737 Cap
Posts: 451
Originally Posted by reCALcitrant
I can't believe people are still arguing over which airline was the crappiest..??? Who care's. They both sucked for different reasons. Act like college educated people and discuss things that matter. On that, we've got to get the 2 pilot cultures to blend at some point so we can get things done when we need to. This means that we'll all have to give and take a little bit.
I can tell you I am probably the most awful negotiator you'll ever meet. I want what I want and I'd rather negotiate with my knee in your chest and knife at your throat. But, this pilot group can't do that with each other as we have to work together for a long time and nothing will be gained by it. Give each other a little slack and listen twice as much as you talk. Hopefully, we can make the place a fun environment in the future.
I can tell you I am probably the most awful negotiator you'll ever meet. I want what I want and I'd rather negotiate with my knee in your chest and knife at your throat. But, this pilot group can't do that with each other as we have to work together for a long time and nothing will be gained by it. Give each other a little slack and listen twice as much as you talk. Hopefully, we can make the place a fun environment in the future.
Scott
06-26-2013, 11:50 AM
#207
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: 737 fo
Posts: 908
Originally Posted by tkhayes90
Just curious, but what else did the CAL side consider?
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